shadowkat | (no subject)

1. Well, the Super managed to fix the outlet in the kitchen, so no more hazardous extension cords. Progress. The bathroom leak, however, has somehow begun to leak into the wall and ceiling of the living room with a few water stains. Hasn't begun to drip in the living room, yet, but I moved the television set just in case. (It was directly below it). Still leaking in the bathroom. They aren't sure what is causing this, since they removed and replaced a huge pipe with a hole in it on Friday.
The plumber is coming to look at it tomorrow.

2. While I'm still enjoying, Captive Prince - Kings Rising, I'm not sure the plot works. Actually it just jarred me out of the story. Having some of the same issues with it that I had with Scandal S4's plot, which also jarred me out of the story. (I think we're on S4). Neither quite tracks. I'm super-sensitive to plot issues, as you probably already know by now because I keep whinging about them when they pop up in television series and books. So it may just be me. (shrugs)

In Captive Prince - Kings Rising,

Jokaste, who betrayed Damen, manages to keep him from killing her by claiming to have sent his son to Laurent's uncle. The only way he'll get his son back is if he trades Jokaste for the boy. Laurent figures out that Jokaste probably didn't have Damen's son at all but Kastor's, so he let's her go. (Mainly because he realizes she cares more for Damen than Kastor, but could see where things were going and chose the means to save Damen's life, which was to take up with Kastor and convince him to sell Damen into slavery, instead of merely killing him. Kastor is the evil half-brother, who lost everything when Damen, the true heir was born.) Laurent also figures out that his uncle could care less about Jokaste and really just wants him to beg for Damen's life and go on trial and be executed instead. And it will be his uncle that they are meeting and not Kastor, or Jokaste's handmaiden/wet nurse -- like Damen believes. Why he doesn't confide any of this to Damen, so they can prepare, I've no clue. Also, why Damen doesn't realize at some point that the Uncle could care less about Jokaste, I've no clue.

Instead they stupidly ride into the King's Meet, where no one is permitted to draw swords on another, upon pain of death. The Uncle, all moustache a-twirling villainy on show, baits Damen into drawing his sword and trying to kill him. By telling him how he'd molested Laurent. (Seriously? Damen hadn't figured that out previously? And what did he think he would achieve by attacking him there, where they are surrounded by armed guards? He may be a bit on the reactionary side, but he's not a total idiot.) And he does it, after Damen is told that's what the Regent was planning on doing...so he just plays right into his hands? Then Laurent begs to be taken into custody? Why doesn't the Regent just kill Damen and take Laurent into custody? Why leave Damen free? There's no reason to bargain, he has both of them at his mercy.

The problem I'm having with the plot is it depends on all the characters acting like idiots to move forward and doing things that are slightly out of character.

I got irritated. The writer clearly had an agenda, she wanted her characters to get to point C. But didn't know how to get them there. So took a weird ass short cut.

Plotting is hard.

In regards to Scandal...

It should be noted that Shondra Rhimes is not a good plotter. She plots like a soap opera writer. So I tend to handwave them most of the time. Since they are emotionally based. That said, this plot...was more off-kilter than most.

Cyrus Beene, Frankie's Vargo's VP, turns out to be the person aka mastermind behind Frankie Vargo's, President Elect's death after all, albeit via an indirect route. He puts in Vargo's wife's head the idea that if Vargo is at his strongest when elected, if and when he gets shot, she'll be the most favorable candidate. She runs with his idea, at his urging, and hires this nasty group to kill her husband, which results in her becoming VP.

Except, the nasty group didn't want her to become VP, they wanted someone else in that slot. Nor did they originally intend for her husband to die, just lose the election. And they framed Cyrus for the assignation and wanted Cyrus to take the fall for it, possibly be executed. If it were up to them, he would have been. And for Mellie to become their puppet President.

Cyrus couldn't have planned all of that, or manipulated it, since he had no way of controlling or knowing that Olivia and her friends would take down the nasty group, LuAnne would become VP or that they'd even catch the nasty people. He's not omniscient. Nor is Luanne. There's too many uncontrollables. And I'm sorry, Cyrus isn't superhuman.

It doesn't work. I thought, yeah, right.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I think it is a bigger problem when there's a large gap between books or episodes, and if there is a sizable fan base. I actually think that may be the reason GRR Martin is having issues completing Song of Ice and Fire, well that and the fact that he's competing now with the television adaptation. He killed off a major character at the end of his last book, a huge fan favorite, but the television series not only killed the character but brought the character back.

And I think, you're correct, it's important to listen to fans or readers to an extent -- in regards to television more than books. I do not think the same rules apply in writing a television series to a book series, mainly because television doesn't have the same level of authorial ownership. It's a different animal than film or books, in that it is by it's very nature a WIP, with each episode scripted often without the writer knowing what they'll write next or what the next season will bring, or if the series will even be continued. Television also by it's very nature is seldom "stand-a-alone", each episode builds on the next, unless it's purely anthological. And even then, television is a collaborative process with no one person responsible for the offering. Add to that, it is either subscriber or advertising revenue based for the most part, so longevity depends on how many people are watching or viewing. (Although this does happen with long-running novel series as well -- being picked up or having your next novel published does depend on the number of sales of the last novel. Often writers can get trapped into writing a novel series about one set of characters, that they've begun to lose interest in, due to the popularity and demand for the series. This happened to Agatha Christie and Conan Doyle, for example. Conan Doyle grew to hate Sherlock Holmes.)

Because television isn't authorial in nature, and has multiple hands involved, I think there's less resistance to listening to input from outside sources. A lot of television shows have people on staff whose sole purpose in life is to scan social media for news of the show, promote the show on social media, and interact with it. You can sort of tell the one's that pay the most attention to social media.

Of course there are television series that have more of an authorial control or tighter authorial feeling to them, where either the show-runner writes all the episodes and directs them, or two people, the show-runner and a director do, or you have a team. Sense8, Fargo, Legion, and True Detective are examples. HBO's The Wire also had a tighter authorial control -- although more writers. As does Game of Thrones. The cable and streaming channels tend to.

Broadcast television shows have far less authorial control. Which is why the plotting is often haphazard in broadcast television shows, the direction substandard, the acting uneven, etc.

I think art works better when there are less people involved, and there's tighter control. If there's too many external influences...it doesn't hold together quite as well. If that makes sense.

Yes, it does make sense and I think that you've got a good point about how television both varies and yet can be the same depending on its production schedule. With those shows written entirely by one or two people, and which are completed before airing is not unlike a series of books. But I think that it's the gaps that matter -- how much of a gap is there between books, between seasons, between sequels, etc. I agree that the greater the gap the more the pressure grows.

The number of influences does make a huge difference, as does the intended audience. What's interesting is often that last one and thus where the conflicts come about. Networks tend to be concerned about a broad audience with creators often concerned with a much more narrow one, which is likely why they're more easily affected by audience reaction.

Agreed. It's very hard to appeal to a broad audience, I think. People, let's face it, have wildly unpredictable and weird tastes. Also often something that is wildly popular five years ago with the masses, isn't now.

I remember taking a marketing course once and being told how impossible it was to accurately predict the market or which way it would lean. And ideas often had a saturation point.

Much easier to appeal to solid nitch audience. And easier to maintain. But even then, depending on the nitch, they can be demanding of specific tropes or conventions. And publishers/networks which pay a lot of attention (possibly too much) to marketing trends, focus groups, and which way the audience is leaning...often pressure the creators to stick to a certain formula or convention.

The only ones allowed to take risks are the established writers, who make millions, like JK Rowling and Stephen King, and literary writers who have grants and prestige, and even those writers are forced to work within the boundaries of the industry's demands.

Really, the only way you can do whatever you want is to self-publish and not care whether you make any money or not. And even there...as a writer you are limited a bit.

It does explain why so many writers sound the same, and don't have a distinctive voice. I've read a lot of books this year, and I can think of only one or two that were distinctive in voice and plot. The rest blur together.