SDCC News...on MCU, DCEU, and others

[shadowkat]

San Diago Comic Con or SDCC did not disappoint this year:

The Trailers & Announcements from the Comic Con for Marvel Universe did not disappoint

They announced all their films and television series up to and including 2025. It's a huge slate. What's also interesting about it - is the heroes are mainly women and people of color. It's not the all white guy slate that was in the past. That's kind of huge.

* Ironheart (Riri Williams takes over the mantle from Downy Jr as Iron Man.) A Black Woman takes over Iron Man's Mantle.
* Echo - a spin-off from Hawkeye
* Agatha: Coven of Chaos - Spinoff from WandaVision
* She Hulk Attorney at Law
* Quantumania - Ant Man and the Wasp - features Cassie Lang, and focuses on the women more.
* DareDevil - Born Again
* Wakanda Forever - Namor is the new villain, and female heroes take center stage with Riri Williams making an appearance, and a new female Black Panther
* The Marvels
* Secret Invasion - starring Samuel L Jackson
* Guardians of the Galaxy Vol.3 - is the last of this series (introduces Adam Warlock)
* Loki S2
*Blade - Marshala Ali stars
* Captain America - New World Order
* Thunderbolts
* Fantastic 4 - Fall 2024
* Avengers - the Kang Dynasty - May 2025
* Avengers - Secret Wars - Fall2025

[This concludes the Multiverse Saga]


The interesting thing about the list..is 90% of the films/television series feature female or person of colors as the leads. I think only four or five out of the twenty some films/series feature white men. If you don't know how big a deal that is - then you've clearly not been watching action/super hero films for as long as I have. You wouldn't have seen that roster in 2008.

Trailers & Announcements from the Comic Con for DC Verse or Warner Brothers was a bit on the scant side

DC is struggling here, partly because they have not done what Marvel did, and invested in top-liner white male characters for too long, and not lesser know characters. Also their big Flash film is having all sorts of on-going casting and production issues. The latest? The actor portraying the lead has been accused of rape or sexual assault, and recently. So that film - which would have been the headliner - was yanked from the line up. Leaving them with just Shazam 2 and Black Adam, neither considered headliner films. And they are focusing more on villains and the Justice Society, because their headliner Justice League films haven't done that well.

List of trailers:

* Black Panther 2 trailer shows what’s next for Wakanda - BEST of the superhero trailers.
Shazam 2 trailer shows off the villains and introduces Rachel Zegler
Netflix’s The Sandman TV series has a trailer worth dreaming about - BEST of all of the Trailers.
New trailer for Rings of Power brings big battles and one familiar flaming enemy
First trailer for Tales of the Walking Dead reveals new sides of the zombie-filled world
Groot lets one rip in first trailer for I Am Groot short series
Dungeons & Dragons movie brings owlbears, gelatinous cubes, and mimics to life in first trailer
Feast your eyes on the first teaser for Teen Wolf: The Movie
Harvey Keitel’s returning to the National Treasure franchise
The Dragon Prince returns to Netflix with a time skip this winter
Gotham Knights’ Batgirl trailer shows Barbara Gordon stepping in to fill the Batman void
Star Trek: Lower Decks sets its parody sights on Deep Space 9 in new trailer
Keanu Reeves and Donnie Yen square off in a sword and gun fight in the John Wick 4 trailer
She-Hulk is joined by Daredevil in new trailer from San Diego Comic Con 2022
The metaverse comes for Mythic Quest in first season 3 teaser
New Black Adam trailer shows off the Justice Society, more antihero antics
Marvel’s Ironheart makes her MCU debut in the Black Panther 2 trailer
Interview with a Vampire gives fans first bite of the new series with a trailer

List of Announcements:

Here’s the official slate for Marvel’s Phase 5 and 6
Avengers: The Kang Dynasty and Avengers: Secret Wars will close out Marvel’s Phase 6
The new animated Avatar movie will star Aang and the Gaang as adults
Black Adam revealed its secret villain to San Diego Comic-Con fans only
The biggest news and announcements from Warner Bros.’ SDCC 2022 panel
Sarah Michelle Gellar joins the Teen Wolf universe
The Pokémon Squishmallows are exceptionally cute
Amazon has already ordered a third season of The Wheel of Time
Here’s everything Crunchyroll showed off at its 2022 Comic-Con industry panel
MultiVersus is adding LeBron James, Rick and Morty to roster
Marvel’s What If...? season 2 is coming early 2023 with more Captain Carter, Neil Gaiman’s 1602
X-Men ’97 reveals Magneto as new leader, plus season 2 on tap
The Walking Dead’s Rick Grimes movie is now a romantic Walking Dead TV show
The Walking Dead’s last eight episodes come to AMC in October
Batman and Spawn will reunite in new story from Todd McFarlane
Daredevil returns with new Disney Plus series Daredevil: Born Again
Star Trek: Strange New Worlds and Lower Decks crews will meet in a crossover event
Nick Fury and Marvel’s Secret Invasion are coming to Disney Plus in 2023
Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania will put a new spin on an old villain
Star Wars Jedi: Survivor toys show off Cal Kestis’ new look
Magic’s Unfinity set will include stickers so players can make their own cards
Marvel announces a Fantastic Four movie release date

**

Other big news coming out of the con..

* Sarah Michelle Gellar as a role in the new Wolf Pack series, as an arson investigator.

* Picard is bringing back the original cast of Star Trek Next Generation for S3 of Picard, also the final season of the series.

* And there's a lot of new fantasy shows dropping soon on streaming and in theaters...

[I found all of this cheering.]

Comments

[spiffikins]

I am irrationally cheered by news of Sarah Michelle Gellar being back on tv/movies! I do like her!

[yourlibrarian]

Yeah DC's best non-male offering so far has been WW (Decent first film, not great second one) and Harley Quinn (who has been sexualized to the nth degree). Mind you, I thought the Quinn standalone film was fine but it's not a big step in the right direction.

[shadowkat]

DC definitely has a problem. They did switch out the idiots who hired Whedon and got themselves into a shit load of trouble on Justice League and The Flash. Also they've gotten rid of traditionalist and conservative film maker, Zach Snyder.

Now, legendary comic book artist and scribe, Jim Lee, is running a lot of DC. And they've shifted focus a bit.

But, it's still uneven, and very male centric. Both Wonder Woman and Harly Quinn are far too sexualized and objectified to work on the same level as Marvel's female heroines. Compare them to say Captain Marvel and Yelena's Black Widow, or Agatha Harkness.

And, most of DC's emphasis right now is either on adult anti-hero films or kiddie fair like Shazam.

Twitter was poking fun at DC. And the Zach Snyder fandom section of DC, was not happy.

[shadowkat]

I like her - but since Buffy she's been awful in every thing she's been in. So too has James Marsters. I've no clue why. I'm not sure if it is the role, the direction, the script or what exactly.

I may try it out of curiosity.

[yourlibrarian]

Speaking of Snyder, this was certainly interesting news: https://www.rollingstone.com/tv-movies/tv-movie-features/justice-league-the-snyder-cut-bots-fans-1384231/

[shadowkat]

Yeah, the Snyder fandom is notoriously toxic. And I'm not surprised by the fact that bots and other fake accounts were engineered. I ventured briefly into it - then jumped out, because these people are nuts. It's just a movie franchise.

I think DC screwed up - they handed over the franchise to Snyder, and that was huge miscalculation. While Marvel went lighter - DC went darker, although DC has always been darker in tone than Marvel.
I can see why they did it - Nolan's Batman films were so popular with the critics, and Nolan kind of suggested they give it to Snyder after he completed his Batman trilogy. But it was so dark and violent, and that won't bring in the broader audience. It's too "nitch". Snyder's fans are about 2 Million if that?

That said, the WB execs kind of deserved it - they are not well-liked in the DC fandom. So not all that hard to take down via social media.

[yourlibrarian]

I mean Marvel was generally lighter anyway, but even so, strategically, it makes more sense to make lighter more humorous stories because they have a broader appeal. So Marvel was likely to pull ahead even though DC already had a lot of earlier hits.

SDCC Reactions

[cjlasky7]

Wow. That was a lot.

-- First, and best of all: the next two Avengers movies and the introduction of the Fantastic Four. I've had some problems with Marvel Studios Phase Four, and I was starting to wonder if this was going anywhere. I'm not worried anymore. I think I know exactly where they're heading. Don't know if it's going to have quite the impact of Infinity War/Endgame, but it could be spectacular.

-- Still, it is a little weird that we're getting the full Kang in Ant-Man, of all places. But if a movie has Rudd, Lilly, Douglas, Pfeiffer, Murray AND MODOK bopping around the Quantum Realm, I'm in.

-- Sarah Michelle Gellar is playing... an arson inspector? She should be the Chosen leader of the Wolf Pack (and she will fulfill their glorious destiny).

-- Wakanda vs. Atlantis is EXACTLY what I wanted for the sequel. It's going to be extremely difficult to measure up to the first movie, because Chadwick Boseman's T'Challa was a perfect central character. (This movie could be all over the place.) But we have Coogler and the rest of that amazing cast... and Namor. (The Sub-Mariner, baby! Woooo!)

--DC comic book movies are something of a mess right now. Yes, The Batman earned a ton of money, but is anything else a sure thing? Ezra Miller's bizarre behavior is eating away The Flash's box office before the movie even hits the theater. Superman is in limbo. Wonder Woman 1984 was a disaster. Aquaman, Shazam and Black Adam look promising...but who knows?

(Believe it or not, the most enthusiasm I've heard on the DC side of things has been for the Harley Quinn cartoon series.)

-- Oh man. I really want to see the Next Generation gang wrap up Picard. I want to see that Strange New Worlds/Lower Decks crossover. Maybe if I get that free month of Paramount+ and time it juuuuust right....

Re: SDCC Reactions

[shadowkat]

1. Kang Dynasty and Secret Wars are allegedly to be the end of the "Multiverse Saga" brought about by Endgame.

Thunderbolts (which is Marvel's version of Suicide Squad) is ending Phase 5. Phase 6 ends with Avengers Secret Wars.

2. Still, it is a little weird that we're getting the full Kang in Ant-Man, of all places.

Not really. You didn't see Loki. Kang was the villain in Loki. This is another variant. That Kang said there were other variants, and a couple were worse than others. He was a variant of the original Kang - who we meet in Antman. He's popping up in more than one film apparently much like Thanos did, but is more prevalent than Thanos, with more development.
Also good casting.

3. Sarah Michelle Gellar is playing... an arson inspector? She should be the Chosen leader of the Wolf Pack (and she will fulfill their glorious destiny).

Well, she's aged. And the way it's set up - there's a bunch of teens who are connected by the same werewolf bite, and there's a villain who sets fires and is after them. It's a teen supernatural show, the kids rule.

4. Wakanda vs. Atlantis is EXACTLY what I wanted for the sequel. It's going to be extremely difficult to measure up to the first movie, because Chadwick Boseman's T'Challa was a perfect central character. (This movie could be all over the place.) But we have Coogler and the rest of that amazing cast... and Namor. (The Sub-Mariner, baby! Woooo!)

They don't really need Chadwick - they have Lupita Nyonga or Nakita as Black Panther, also Riri Williams, Ironheart. And to be honest? The strength of the first one was the women characters.

It does follow the books - it was the Atlantean/Wakanda War that was the focus in the comics.
Also, there's plans to do spin-offs or series with Namor if he takes off.

5.Ezra Miller's bizarre behavior is eating away The Flash's box office before the movie even hits the theater. Superman is in limbo. Wonder Woman 1984 was a disaster. Aquaman, Shazam and Black Adam look promising...but who knows?

It has issues.

* The Flash is in post-production hell because of Ezra Miller - who has multiple allegations against him. That's harder to fix than Aguaman and Amber Heard.

* Aguaman: Amber Heard was a lead in Aquaman 2 - and they've had to remove her completely from the film, and it's put the film in post-production hell. I'm not sure it can find its way out.

* Snyder fans are driving them nuts. Because of the whole Snyder and Whedon mess, they are planning on shifting completely away from Justice League and the members of it, and redirecting towards Justice Society, Black Adam, and Suicide Squad. Superman is permanently on hold. Wonder Woman appears to be on hiatus, and it's not clear if there will be a Batman sequel. Series wise - we have Superman & Lois, The Flash, Star Girl, and Gotham Knights. That's it. Also the CW is in trouble, so we'll see.

* Also John Constantine and Dark Justice League or the Dark Arts Group. There's a limited series planned with HBO Max featuring Constantine, which is why Gaiman wasn't permitted to use John Constantine in the Netflix Sandman series, and used Johanna Constantine instead. Constantine was very popular in Legends of Tomorrow and they are rebooting his series for HBO and plan to do a movie with Constantine and other supernatural dark arts practioners.

* So, basically it's just Shazam, Batman, Black Adam, Star Girl (Justice Society), Justice Society, Constantine..right now.

They changed show-runners. Jim Lee is now running things, Geoff Johns is gone, and he was behind the Flash. I'm disappointed in a way, the Flash looked interesting.

* And an oddball jewel that has me excited - "Sandman" coming to Netflix in August - they are doing Preludes & Nocturns through Dollhouse, and Gaiman is in charge with Tom Sturridge.

6. Paramount Plus isn't that expensive. It's among the cheaper of the streamers. I got it for about .99 a month, I think on Amazon. It has all the Star Trek stuff - and I do mean "all" of it. It also has all of the King's stuff - Evil, Good Fight, and it has all of Taylor Sheridan's Modern Western stuff. Plus all of those procedurals, and reality shows you love on CBS.

I'd steer you towards it over say Amazon, Netflix, Apple or HBO. Disney is worth it too - it's not that pricey.

[shadowkat]

True. Marvel can be pretty dark - but the dark stuff tended to be Daredevil, Alias Jessica Jones, Luke, Electra, Punisher, and to some extent Wolverine, and of course The X-men.

DC in stark contrast - was just dark. I don't think they have much of any lighter fare. Maybe Wonder Woman? I mean if you consider Harley Quinn...which is rather violent.

So yeah, once Marvel got its act together, and the technology was available, it was only a matter of time for it to pull ahead. I don't think DC had much of a chance. The smartest thing DC can do at this point is to go in a different direction - which they are doing, focusing on things like Sandman, anti-heros, and offbeat stuff, while putting their top team up off to one side.

Re: Re: SDCC Reactions

[cjlasky7]

1. I was aware that Kang (or one of his variants) popped up at the end of Loki. But Quantumania seems to be his debut as real antagonist. I'm just saying that poor Scott Lang might be way overmatched here. Usually when Kang shows up, the Avengers have to be at full strength if they have even a prayer of beating him. Scott's going to be lucky if he makes it out alive.

2. True, Black Panther 2 doesn't NEED T'Challa to work; the cast is strong enough without him. But every relationship in the first movie was centered around the king, and now they're going to have to redefine their roles without him.

Who is the new Black Panther? Nakia? Shuri? How about Okoye? M'Baku? Does Killmonger come out of Atlantean deep freeze and make another play for the title?

Who is the new ruler? Is Ramonda the ruling monarch now, instead of Queen Mother? Or is Princess Shuri running things? (Does Wakanda even WANT a monarchy anymore?)

The Wakandans have a lot to sort out. But they'd better have their shit together when Atlantis attacks, because Namor is serious business.

The trailer looks FANTASTIC. But a Black Panther movie without T'Challa is going to be tricky.

3. Sandman (in the comics) isn't a big, sweeping epic. It has its arcs, but Gaiman likes to amble down side roads and tell stories about the people he meets on the way. The Netflix series looks like it'll have more of a continuing storyline, with the Corinthian as a major antagonist.

Either way, it'll be fine, because Gaiman has made it clear to everyone that nothing, NOTHING goes on the screen without his approval.

4. Amber Heard is being edited out of Aquaman? WHY?! She hasn't killed or assaulted anyone, or tortured puppies. So she was in a toxic relationship with an asshole, there was a big trial, and a few idiots on the internet didn't like her. So? Is that a reason to spend untold millions slicing up a potential tent pole superhero movie? I thought the bean counters at Warners wanted to MAKE money....

5. Speaking of the DC Cinematic Universe: what's the problem? Why is this so hard? You just need someone to point to the Justice League Unlimited animated series and say, "That!" The characters are all there. The relationships are well defined. You've got all the villains you need. Can WB just borrow Kevin Feige for two minutes? Because all the second guessing and bet hedging is getting ridiculous.

[svgurl]

It is interesting (in a good way) that Marvel is finally moving ahead and embracing diversity after refusing to release a Black Widow movie until Wonder Woman came out and was successful (and the character was dead on screen). And they had a bankable star in ScarJo too. I am still the most excited about Cap 4.

You would think that since DC had more mainstream heroes, it would be easier (though that also means competing with nostalgia) but they haven't had luck with the Superman movies (Returns didn't go anywhere either, so this predates the MCU) and then as you said, there was the whole mess with Whedon and Snyder. Cavill certainly looks the part too so that's a shame.

I liked the first WW movie (not 1984) the first Aquaman movie and I was looking forward to The Flash before how everything has gone down with Ezra Miller. I feel like they've had slightly more luck in the TV/animated categories, but they need to figure out a direction that works, movie wise.

Re: Re: SDCC Reactions

[shadowkat]

1. Quantumania isn't Scott Lang's movie - apparently Cassie, Hope and in particular Janet Van Dyne are taking front and center - they are building up to having "The Wasp" be the front-header here, and Cassie Lang to come into her own.

2. Who is the new Black Panther? Nakia? Shuri? How about Okoye? M'Baku? Does Killmonger come out of Atlantean deep freeze and make another play for the title?

According to the Trailer and SDCC - the new black panther is played by Lupita Nyong, or is Nakia.
(It's not a man. Lupita is wearing the custom, and this is actually in keeping with the comics. They flirted with Shuri, but ran into issues with the actress (who refused to be vaccinated or wear a mask).

So, it's really not a mystery.

Who is the new ruler? Is Ramonda the ruling monarch now, instead of Queen Mother? Or is Princess Shuri running things? (Does Wakanda even WANT a monarchy anymore?)

My guess is Nakia - who most likely married T'Challa, and is taking over for him.

They made the choice not to bring back Killmonger, and to not recast T'Challa, instead they followed the comics - which also killed off T'Challa for a bit, and had his sister, and then his wife play the role and rule.

It also fits with a trend in the MCU Phase 4 which is tilting towards People of Color and Women in the lead roles.

4. They have chosen to go the "Epic" or "Good Omens" route with Sandman and not the anthology route which was in the comics. Neil Gaiman breaks down the trailer and explains in detail the choices they made, and why. The Cover artist of the Sandman comics is doing the credits sequence. (Gaiman is fantastic at credits sequences - the Good Omens credit sequence is among the best I've ever seen). They apparently chose to focus more on one villain, and on Dream's Journey back after being caged for so long, to reclaim control over his realm.

I'm looking forward to it. I don't know how well it'll do - although Sandman has a huge fan base. I'm not part of the fan base. I barely read all of Preludes and Nocturns, I jump in and out of the comics, because they are more anthology than serial based, and Gaiman...is more into world-building than character/plot building. He's a gardner not a plotter - he likes to wander off and plant some wild vine, when he should be tending to the roses. Kind of the comic book version of GRR Martin.

Although with fantasy - it's almost better if you are like that. Fantasy fans prefer gardners to plotters, because in fantasy its all about the world building and details.

4. Amber Heard is being edited out of Aquaman? WHY?! She hasn't killed or assaulted anyone, or tortured puppies. So she was in a toxic relationship with an asshole, there was a big trial, and a few idiots on the internet didn't like her. So? Is that a reason to spend untold millions slicing up a potential tent pole superhero movie? I thought the bean counters at Warners wanted to MAKE money....

Sigh. It's complicated. Ugly. And headache-inducing. Plus from the court case - it's really not clear who the abuser was in this. As far as I can tell from a very safe distance, Depp won the case. Heard is appealing. And WB is well...skittish.

[Also this not helped by the fact that Heard is...a bit of a right-winger? And has said some things that were ahem anti-LGBTA. So politically correct - she's not.]

It's not really clear if they've replaced her or cut her. Rumor is that she has, she denies it. If they plan to recast or cut her - they need to move fast - the film is due for release in March 2023.
But, it has issues - people, particularly women, really dislike her.

Heard Denies Being Cut from Aguaman.

You might care. I don't. I don't care about Aquaman. I didn't like the first film all that much - I found it cringe inducing in places. Let's hope Marvel does a better job with Namor.

5. DC's problem is the showrunners. Geoff Johns from all reports was a bit of a tool. They stole Whedon from Marvel hoping to get a bit of Marvel's magic, not realizing that Marvel had dumped Whedon prior to the steal. Marvel was taking out the trash. DC kept picking it up.

Jim Lee used to be with Marvel too - back in the 1990s. And he's by no means stellar.

Also DC's other problem is they built their verse around the Dark Knight. Marvel kind of did that too with Iron Man, but Iron Man is a tongue in cheek take on Batman, and doesn't take himself quite so seriously - also Marvel went with charismatic actor and brought him front and center, as opposed to pulling the villains front and center, and putting Batman in the shadows, and highlighting an auteur director. You don't want auteur directors on superhero flicks - you want directors who can get the job done and make the actors happy. The audience of a superhero flick doesn't generally speaking pay all that much attention to the director, they care who stars in it - and how close it is to the source material.

They need to go back to the lighter touch of Richard Donner's Superman, and pull away from Snyder and Nolan and Burton's darker influences. Also, I'd back away a bit from Batman, and focus more on lesser known characters like say Nova, Nightwing, Black Canary, Green Arrow, etc. Also get away from the villains.

[shadowkat]

I'm looking forward to Wakanda Forever, Fantastic 4, Echo, Daredevil...sigh. I'm not a Captain America fan - government conspiracy and war stuff annoys me - and that tends to be the focus of Captain America. That said, Falcon as Captain America definitely makes the character more interesting. Particularly since he is just a regular human and doesn't have the juice.

DC's problem is that it's too mainstream - or too well known. It can't do lesser known characters as successfully as Marvel could. People expect DC to do Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman...
while Marvel can kind of do whatever it wants.

Superman - the most successful was the first one - Richard Donner's film with Christopher Reeves, which blended humor, and wasn't as dark and brooding as Snyder's with Caville. Also Reeves was prettier than Caville (and a better actor - he could do comedy, Caville isn't as adept).
Rebooting it has been problematic. For a bit - they were going to do a Black Superman, written by Ta Cohnesi Nates (sp?) but that seems to have been put on hold or fallen through - too much push back.
Superman is a bit too iconic a character to play around with. So is Batman. And that's the problem.