OUAT fannish bits...

[shadowkat]

1. Five wonderful things about shipping Emma Swan/Baelfire on Once Upon a Time

* Swanfire is a cool name
* The writers are pro ship and the ship is laced with loads of irony
* It's not abusive
* they already have a kid and he's 11
* the traditional gender roles have been switched up a bit

If you ever decide to ship a star-crossed romance on a tv series it's a good idea to pick one that is a) not abusive, and b) the writers support. Also helps if it's two grownups who have a history, and aren't under the age of 20 and have an equal footing. If they aren't equals, your ship is doomed. Plus, a kid already out there and part of their family - assures at least some longevity.

2. Once Upon a Time for the uninitiated?

Imagine the characters of all your favorite children's tales mashed up in a grown up adventure story?

Imagine what would happen if the Evil Queen from the Snow White fairy tale survived and decided with a curse created by Rumplestilskin to curse all of the fairy tale and storybook characters - so they are ripped away from their magical realms and thrust into our own? Now take that a step further...the daughter of Snow White and Prince Charming hooks up with a thief who happens to be the son of Rumplestilskin, and she has a kid with him, Henry. For complicated reasons, ie. she's 18 and in jail, she gives Henry up for adoption. Rumplestilskin procures Henry for the Evil Queen, not knowing who he is or who his parents are. 11 years later, Henry who figures something is wrong here since no one has changed or aged in 11 years but Henry, obtains a fairy book from his favorite teacher (Snow White) and goes off to find his mom. The mom reluctantly returns with him to Storybrook, where over the course of the season - she meets her parents, and breaks the curse.In the next season they are reunited with Henry's father and Rumple's son (the whole reason that Rumple created the curse), Baelfire, and Baelfire's new fiancee turns out to be an anti-magic covert agent and kidnaps Henry after thrusting an injured and possibly dying Baelfire through a porthole. They grab Henry and jump to Neverland.

S3? Captain Hook, Snow White, Prince Charming, Rumplestilskin, the Evil Queen, and Emma Swan board Hook's ship to sail to Neverland, in order to save Henry from Peter Pan. Meanwhile Baelfire struggles to find his way out of the Enchanted Forest with Mulan, Sleeping Beauty, and Prince Phillip. While Henry flees the Lost Boys and Peter Pan in Neverland.

Oh so much fun. It's like watching a cracky fanfic mashup by the writers worked on Lost, BSG and Buffy.

Also comforting. Because the moral code tends to be "revenge is bad and has consequences", "everyone screws up", and "things work out in the end".


3. Once Upon a Time due to its funky narrative structure, works better when you watch it on DVD without commercials and one episode after another. Scandal is another series that works best in this fashion. It's pure serial. The B story thread is flashbacks, like LOST. It has the same narrative character centric structure that LOST did.

The dialogue is actually really good in some episodes. The best episodes to date, is basically any that focus on Rumplestilskin - in part due to Robert Carylye who like Alan Cummings has the ability to make anything work for him. It also helps that the writers are enamored of the character and wrote it for Carylyle.

Favorite episodes to date?

1. Manhattan (S2) - which is the payoff from the buildup over S1, includes the pivotal moment in Rumple's back story
2. Talhassee (S2) - Emma meets Neal, and works with Hook
3. The Miller's Daughter (S2) - Cora and Rumple - or the Rumplestilskin tale with a twist
4. Pilot - the first episode - where Emma comes to Storybrook
5. Desperate Souls - the Rumplestilskin backstory or how he becomes the Dark One, also reflects on Emma's tale
5. The Hat Trick - the Mad Hatter's Tale and it sheds more light on Emma's back story
6. Red-handed - a twist on Little Red Riding Hood
7. The Land Without Magic
8. The Crocodile (Rumple and Hook's back story)
9. Welcome to Storybrook (reads like a 1980s Stephan King horror story)
10. Second Star to the Right..


Favorite characters:

* Emma
* Baelfire/Neal
* Rumplestilskin/Gold
* Snow White
* Henry
* Charming
* Hook/Killigan

And Regina is growing on me. The actress is quite good.

Ships?

: = platonic or familial
/ = romantic
* = main ones

* Emma/Neal
* Emma:Henry
* Emma:Henry:Neal
* Emma: Rumple
* Rumple:Henry
* Rumple:Baelfire
* Snow:Emma
*Charming:Henry
*Charming:Rumple
*Charming:Emma
*Charming/Snow
Hook/Emma (fling, nothing permanent)
Hook:Baelfire
Hook:Mella
*Hook:Rumpe:Baelfire:Henry:Emma:Snow:Charming
Regina:Emma
Ruby/Whale
Rumple/Cora

Comments

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

Wondering what's in the cards for the EmmaFire ship when he's in FTL and she's in Neverland.

Maybe he'll find out somehow his kid's in danger and join them back in that place I reckon he never wants to return to....

And, of course, she'll sort of grunt, "Glad you're not dead" like she isn't ten kinds of relieved and happy about it.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Well, he'll have to find a way of getting there first. Neverland requires a portal. And all the portal beans have been destroyed.
Doesn't mean he won't.

I have a feeling what they are going to do is build up the Emma/Hook relationship (after all she believes Neal is dead), and about the time she and Hook are this_close to getting it on, up pops Neal and we have an ironic reflection of Hook/Mella/Rumple except this round, Hook's the odd guy out and it also plays on Hook's guilt regarding Bae, who is the son of his one true love, Mellah. (these writers adore ironic set-ups.) Although, we got Mulan in the mix - so there's a possibility of an interesting love quadrangle emerging. Baelfire has a thing for warrior women and Emma has a thing for pirates and thieves. LOL!

I'd write that story - with the end game being Neal/Emma of course.

Nice thing though about Once is the pacing is fast. Much faster than Lost or Buffy ever were. They resolve plot threads quickly in this verse. So he'll probably be reunited with her by the end of the first half of the season. Unless they decide to do that during the second half? (Season is being broken into two 11 episode halves or mini-seasons.)

I also think next season, after watching some of the commentary, that we're going to get more back-stories on Tamara, Emma, and how Regina acquired Henry.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

I am not getting any of my LJ notifications and haven't been for over a week. Maddening.

Yes, it will be tough for Neal to get to Neverland, but I'm sure the writers have something in mind. The real question will be will Masq get impatient and overlook the other nutty goodness going on in the meantime.

I kind of loathe the idea of Emma/Hook, because she's too smart for that, and they'd have to dumb her down with hormones to get her past the "He's pretty but NoWaiInHell" stage. But, as you say, a triangle with Hook and Baelfire as rivals would make for some interesting emotional shenanigans.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

I don't think they'll do a Belle/Rumple bit with Emma/Hook. (dear ghod, I hope not). What I think they'll play on is the loner/trust no one mentality that both characters share, along with the fact that both were thieves, and abandoned by parents and lost their one true love.

Keep in mind the similarities. Also Emma is not proud of her past and doesn't view herself as a hero - that was one of the things I picked up on in my re-watch. Emma doesn't see herself as heroic and is ashamed of her own past and hunting redemption. (Personally, I think she's being a bit hard on herself - but I relate to that.)

In the episode Straight on Til Morning - Emma tells Hook that she gets where he's coming from and understands him, that they are alike in this way, the desire not to trust anyone, to push everyone away and take care of just yourself - been there/done that - but in the end you're just alone.

Plus add to this Hook's feelings towards Baelfire, a person that he feels he failed in some way and does care about. And the fact that Emma is the one woman he can't charm at all - so a challenge. And..
they understand each other.

It's a fascinating and complicated dynamic. I don't think they can last nor do I foresee a hot and heavy romance (like you said, Emma's too smart for that and not the type to go for it)- but I do think they can explore some interesting angles. Plus that's a small ship.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

Plenty to get them to bond, I agree. I do hope the writers (who are not Jane Espenson) don't make the maddening mistake of thinking just because a male and female character who are not genetically related have a lot in common or chemistry or connect on many levels automatically = UST/sex/relationship material.

Besides, if she *were* to fall for Hook, her mama would give her a well-deserved spanking.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Forget her mother - Charming and Rumplestilskin would have a thing or two to say about it.

No, I see more a deep friendship and possibility of unrequited love on Hook's part. It is possible though - after all she began to fall for Graeham.

I don't see long-term. Hook's the charming rogue type. Besides Neal's still alive and Neal is Emma's love.

I personally prefer friendships and familial relationships in tv, because UST/Sexual relationships are handled poorly. But I'll give OUAT credit - they are handling two star-crossed romances fairly well: Charming/Snow and Baelfire/Emma.

I'm admittedly NOT a fan of Rumplestilskin/Belle type of ship - it's Belle who is bugging me in that one. I think it's the cliche, girl with a savior complex loves bad boy with heart of gold and believes she can save him because she's the only one who sees the good in him. Ugh. Although at least Once gets the fact that you can save someone who a)doesn't want saving and b) doesn't think they need it. But Belle's idiotic romanticism (played to great effect in the Good Morning Storybrooke extra...where she thinks the great tragic romances all end happily) is one sign of it.

So far OUAT is doing a good job of building up its romantic relationships and not just throwing them at us. So if it did happen between Hook and Emma - it would take time and built up of trust - which could happen in Neverland. Their interests are aligned.
But I do agree with Emma falls into the Belle trap - I'll be annoyed.
One Belle per show is more than enough.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that bit with Belle and the tragic romances she sees different endings for was Very Telling about the writers' thinking about her. I am rather squicked by Belle/Rumplestiltskin, but not interested enough to root for or against them.

How much do I LOVE that Rumple is an Emma/Nealfire 'shipper though? That's awesome to behold, but not any guarantee there's a long term future for E/N (kind of the opposite in fact--Rumple tends to destroy everything he touches, but I'm paranoid).

I do hope it continues to stay his hand where the product of Emma and Neal is concerned.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Right there with you on Belle/Rumple - I am rather squicked by them as well, but far too ambivalent to really care whether they get together or not or to expend energy in fighting people over it. I don't really want either with anyone else so that helps.

I do think the writers are somewhat tongue fully in cheek regarding the pairing. The commentary on two of the episodes was telling. Plus there's a pattern in Belle's behavior that I picked up on upon the rewatch: 1) she is "proud" of her ability to rehabilitate monsters and brags about it on numerous occasions, (in fact Regina plays her - using that knowledge), 2) she sees Rumple as "cursed" similar to "Philip being turned into a monster by Mal" - he's not cursed, he tells her he chose it, but she doesn't quite want to see it, 3) she likes impossible relationships - the more impossible the better, 4) as Lacey - she demonstrated a definite love for nasty abusive bad boys who liked to beat up people...I'm guessing Belle's a bit repressed.
I feel sorry for the Rumpele/Belle shippers - you got to know that ship is not going to end well. They never do.

How much do I LOVE that Rumple is an Emma/Nealfire 'shipper though? That's awesome to behold,

Oh so agree. I adored his little exchange with Nealfire.

Neal: You never even took the time to get to know Tamara.
Rumple: Why should I?
Neal: I'm marrying her -
Rumple: Oh that'll never last, not when you are clearly still carrying a torch for Emma.

LOL!

Rumple over-identifies with Emma. And they are paralleled beautifully.
Both lose Baelfire through a portal. Both lose their sons through a portal. Both have parental abandonment issues. Both have child abandonment issues.

but not any guarantee there's a long term future for E/N (kind of the opposite in fact--Rumple tends to destroy everything he touches, but I'm paranoid).

True. I'm not sure where they'll go with it. I don't see a happy romance on Emma's horizon. Charming/Snow can be happy because they are sort of in the background, or her parents. But Emma is going to struggle more.

I do hope it continues to stay his hand where the product of Emma and Neal is concerned.

Well, it will be interesting to see what he does if Emma hooks up with (I have to come up with a different phrase) Hook and Neal pops up again. Or for that matter if Neal hooks up with someone else (although I don't see that happening after the Tamara fiasco.)

Both Emma and Neal have major issues in regards to romance.

Emma - got played by Neal and August, and when she fell for Sheriff Graeham, Regina ripped his heart out. (another link to Rumple - Regina told him that she killed Belle and Cora ripped her own heart out)

Neal - abandoned Emma to be noble, left Wendy Darling to be noble, and got played by Tamara.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

Sorry. "Product of Emma and Neal"=Henry

[kathyh]

Once Upon a Time due to its funky narrative structure, works better when you watch it on DVD without commercials and one episode after another.

Yup, that's what I've decided too. I watched Season 1 like that and really enjoyed it. I was watching Season 2 as it's being shown weekly here but was losing the thread and not concentrating, so I've decided to wait until the DVD comes out and marathon it then.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Discovered during the rewatch/marathon that I like the series better. Characters decisions that did not make much sense during the season, do upon the rewatch. It just weaves together better.

The commercials sort of break it up and make it harder to follow - even when you are DVRing and fast-forwarding through them. In part because it takes ten minutes to fast forward through commercial breaks.

Regina for example? Didn't make any sense when I watched it live. But in the rewatch - she does and her arc works beautifully as does both Snow's and Cora's - arcs that bugged me during the live watch.

[kathyh]

I found Snow and Charming's arc worked so much better in S1 when watched all in one go. It's actually a bit of a high risk strategy to make a show that is better not watched on the tv, but kudos to them for making a show that is more interesting that way (if they meant to).

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Agreed. I found I liked Snow and Charming quite a bit on re-watch and marathon, while when I watched them live they began to get on my nerves.

It is risky. But they pace it well - it resolves its storylines fast. And they wisely didn't keep Snow and Charming apart in the Storybrook timeline that long. (No Buffy/Angel crap, thank you ghod.)

Surprising this is as tightly plotted and quickly paced - considering they do not pre-plan and sort of make it up as they go.