Losing the Writ of Habeas Corpus and Allowing Torture, why this matters

[shadowkat]

Read:

1. http://twistedchick.livejournal.com/

2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KgkrApJ5PE&eurl=

Definition of what the writ of Habeaus Corpus means:

3. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habeas_corpus

4.http://leisureguy.wordpress.com/2006/09/13/goodbye-habeus-corpus/

5. From Congress.org: https://ssl.capwiz.com/congressorg/issues/alert/?alertid=9062621&content_dir=ua_congressorg

6. About how the US Congress passed a bill to allow torture and infringe on our writ of habeaus corpus: http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/security_guantanamo_dc

7.http://www.staceyforcongress.com/petitions/pnum518.php - yes, it's a site for a guy running for congress, but it does have a place where you can send letters to your congressman and senators and newspapers stating how you hate this action. If someone can find a better link, am all for it.

8. Updated to include a great link from petzipellepingo that lists all the people in Congress and The Senate that voted for this thing and who are up for re-election in November.
http://www.the-principle.net/blog/

9. Here's the NY Congress people who voted for it - Peter King - http://www.congress.org/congressorg/bio/?id=406
(NY - Congressman for the 3rd district. Been there for 7 terms. Is a Republican.) And Randy Kuhl - https://ssl.capwiz.com/congressorg/bio/?id=6966. He's in his first term.

[***My message, more or less stated something to the effect: "Please do not support bills that derail or override our rights. Do not allow the Executive Branch the power to make these decisions without any checks in place. If we permit our rights to be infringed upon in this manner, we are giving the terrorists what they want. You cannot fight evil with evil. Terrorism is about forcing people to lose hope, give up their dreams, and infringe on their rights out of fear. If we continue to infringe upon our rights and the very values our country stands for out of a need for vengeance or retribution or to feel safe, the terrorists have won." (Or something like that, can't remember the exact words.)

Comments

[petzipellepingo.livejournal.com]

I may not have a better site but this (http://www.the-principle.net/blog/) is an excellent discussion from someone on my flist.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Thanks - updated post to include it.

[embers-log.livejournal.com]

Thank you so much for these links, this is a very important issue and one that needs a response.
Everyone can easily get the e-mail (and postal) addresses here:
http://www.webslingerz.com/jhoffman/congress-email.html

The other day I heard an actual reporter say that the popularity of '24' proves (!) that the American people are in favor of aggressive covert action against terrorism (I've always had a deeply set suspicion of shows that engrandize these secret agencies in the US).

[arethusa2.livejournal.com]

Two more years of this. It's hideous.

Maybe we just have to realize that this is a permanent stuggle that demands constant counteraction. But how can we fight these bills when people don't care what happens to foreigners and don't believe that they could ever become victims themselves? Is it just a certain group of people--the same ones that have been messing up our government for a long time, starting with Nixon, resurfacing with Reagan (Iran-contra) and coming back from the dead with the current Bush? Or is it just a part of human nature to crave security, no matter what the cost?

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Ah, you're back. Missed you. I thought you'd left lj? Going back to add you to correspondence list again. (I took off everyone who hadn't posted in ages and appeared to either be gone completely or just lurking.)

It feels hopeless right now, doesn't it? Only way you can fight them is to continue to make sure your voice is heard. The squeaky wheel gets the crease in politics. My first reaction was what can I do? Better to just ignore it. Just makes my blood boil. Go argue about some silly tv show that will be off the air in 2-3 years instead. But, but, what if a letter or a vote does change things? What if we all voted the people who voted Yay on these bills out of office? Sent a message to our government that we don't feel safe and they are not doing a good job?

Having spent a great deal of time over the past two years with people who loved Bush and hated Clinton, I honestly think a lot of it has to do with what you believe, what you value most, and what news media you watch. Some people like security no matter what. I remember having a discussion with a woman, a good/kind/honest woman who is a strong advocate of animal rights, about politics - she stated Hitler had the right idea, we had too many rights, people should be controlled. Things should be orderly. Then she'd be safe. I countered that if she looked at history, she'd notice the inherent flaw of that view - every tolitarian and fascist regime has been responsible for killing thousands of people. It's all fine and well, if you agree with whomever is in control, but if you don't?
You are dead. What happens if the person in charge decides they hate dogs? And make it illegal for you to own a dog, because dogs can cause rabies? Do you still want this nice orderly regime? She wanted to make the world black and white. Neat and tidy. But it's not that simple.

And a lot of people believe the Right Wing propaganda machine. They need to. It makes them feel safe.
What's so frustrating is they don't seem to see the costs. That people are dying in Iraq. That human rights are being violated right and left. As long as it isn't their rights or their families rights or their friends rights they don't care. And they justify it by saying - but hey, we're safe. No, I'm sorry, we really aren't. Safety is an illusion. You are never safe.

[arethusa2.livejournal.com]

I spent the summer off lj, trying to get my head together. Unpleasant, but necessary.

I agree that people's politics are often influenced by their personal beliefs, values, etc. A relative of mine votes for Bush becuse he believes in good and evil--and since America and the military are good, Bush and wars are good. Another likes Bush because his party has all the power, and she feels powerless. It gets pretty complicated.mmBut both would swear they are Republicans for the policy, not for other reasons.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Ahhh. Totally get that. Took a couple months off myself a while back. And occassionally feel the need to back off posting. It gets addictive. And well, if you are in a bad mood or weird frame of mind, explosive - at least for me. Been posting more lately, out of boredom and yes, looking for a job again - which means I'm on the net more.

The Republican Party's propaganda machine is doing its job, rather well. And people, don't like to think that hard or worry about things, particularly things they don't feel they have much control over anyway. After 9/11, many people, myself included, felt powerless against an unseeable, unknowable entity that had decided to kill us just for living in the US.

We wanted someone else to handle the tough stuff - like our defense, our security, even to a degree our finances. Make it better. We live in a society that bombards us with information, choices, and decisions on a hourly basis...it makes sense that we don't want to deal with it.

Bush has done an amazingly good job of taking on a sort of kindly father-figure role. I think it's difficult sometimes for people to see the issues beneath the flags waving and speechs. People forget that our leaders only have the power we are willing to give them.
The media makes it easy for us to forget.

[fishsanwitt]

This is all so horrible.

Thank you for the links.