Politics Redux
Sep. 10th, 2008 09:06 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
shadowkatWas reminded of a few things tonight. Spoke with a friend who told me that he did not think Rock Star Sarah was going to win this election. Because when it came down to it, we vote for the President not the Vice President. And Sarah and McCain to date still have not mentioned anything regarding how they will fix our economy, which let's face it is the number one topic for 80% of Americans. Food prices have gone up, mortages are up, fuel is up, education is up, everything but the value of our property, our cars, and our jobs has risen. Middle Class Americans are using food stamps. And over 85,000 jobs were lost this past month. And all Sarah and John talk about is Iraq? He also reminded me that it is not Sarah Palin who upsets me, it is her policies and her views. The fact that I do not agree that the Bible should be read literally or interpreted literally. (I don't. It is my problem with 80% of the Christian Religions - the fact that they believe the Bible is a "biblical record of factual information handed to us directly from God" - while I believe the Bible is an anthology made up of fables, morality tales, historical records, poems, stories, and songs passed down orally and written by men to explain their beliefs, figure out the world, philosophy, and comment on what was happening - often via metaphors. To read it literally to me is a bit like watching Buffy the Vampire Slayer and seeing that as the Gospel, and believing vampires really exist. I do not believe that the Bible should be interpreted literally and that attempting to follow it's dictates literally only leads to hypocrisey and destruction and horrible things - because it contradicts itself in places and like any written work, is complicated.) I despise her world view not her. It's an important thing to remember - that we don't hate a person, we just disagree with how they see the world, for it is the opposite of how we do.
He told me that while he did not think McCain would win this, that the polls are the popular vote not the electoral vote where Obama is still leading, he is afraid there is an outside chance that Obama may lose primarily because he is African-American or Black. There are quite a few working class middle Americans out there from small towns, who no matter how bad things get, how poor they are, would never in a million years vote for an African-American ('Negro') for President. I pray this isn't true, but I read this morning in the paper, how NY's first African-American Governor, David Patterson, saw racism implicit not advert, but implicit in Sarah Palin's speechs and between the lines. And yes, I see it too. Sarah is like a lot of small town white Americans - who have lived in one place their entire lives and never interacted with a diverse group of people - she's Archie Bunker from All in the Family. Say what you will about Norman Lear but he nailed middle American white bigotry and it has not disappeared.
That said? This election is a positive one. It is the first time in US History that two women, and a black man ran as viable candidates for President. Not only that, they got more attention than the White Guys. That's major. It gives me hope that maybe we are beginning to move away from the old boys club. Regardless of the outcome - the fact that a woman and a black man ran as viable candidates - and one of them will either be President or in line for President of the US, when just a few decades ago neither had the right to vote - is something to celebrate and worth remembering.
Anywho - got this from another friend via email tonight:
Eve Ensler, the American playwright, performer, feminist and activist best known for "The Vagina Monologues", wrote the following about Sarah Palin.
___________________________________
Drill, Drill, Drill
I am having Sarah Palin nightmares. I dreamt last night that she was a member of a club where they rode snowmobiles and wore the claws of drowned and starved polar bears around their necks. I have a particular thing for Polar Bears. Maybe it's their snowy whiteness or their bigness or the fact that they live in the arctic or that I have never seen one in person or touched one. Maybe it is the fact that they live so comfortably on ice. Whatever it is, I need the polar bears.
I don't like raging at women. I am a Feminist and have spent my life trying to build community, help empower women and stop violence against them. It is hard to write about Sarah Palin. This is why the Sarah Palin choice was all the more insidious and cynical. The people who made this choice count on the goodness and solidarity of Feminists.
But everything Sarah Palin believes in and practices is antithetical to Feminism which for me is part of one story -- connected to saving the earth, ending racism, empowering women, giving young girls options, opening our minds, deepening tolerance, and ending violence and war.
I believe that the McCain/Palin ticket is one of the most dangerous choices of my lifetime, and should this country chose those candidates the fall-out may be so great, the destruction so vast in so many areas that America may never recover. But what is equally disturbing is the impact that duo would have on the rest of the world. Unfortunately, this is not a joke. In my lifetime I have seen the clownish, the inept, the bizarre be elected to the presidency with regularity.
Sarah Palin does not believe in evolution. I take this as a metaphor. In her world and the world of Fundamentalists nothing changes or gets better or evolves. She does not believe in global warming. The melting of the arctic, the storms that are destroying our cities, the pollution and rise of cancers, are all part of God's plan. She is fighting to take the polar bears off the endangered species list. The earth, in Palin's view, is here to be taken and plundered. The wolves and the bears are here to be shot and plundered. The oil is here to be taken and plundered. Iraq is here to be taken and plundered. As she said herself of the Iraqi war, "It was a task from God."
Sarah Palin does not believe in abortion. She does not believe women who are raped and incested and ripped open against their will should have a right to determine whether they have their rapist's baby or not.
She obviously does not believe in sex education or birth control. I imagine her daughter was practicing abstinence and we know how many babies that makes.
Sarah Palin does not much believe in thinking. From what I gather she has tried to ban books from the library, has a tendency to dispense with people who think independently. She cannot tolerate an environment of ambiguity and difference. This is a woman who could and might very well be the next president of the United States . She would govern one of the most diverse populations on the earth.
Sarah believes in guns. She has her own custom Austrian hunting rifle. She has been known to kill 40 caribou at a clip. She has shot hundreds of wolves from the air.
Sarah believes in God. That is of course her right, her private right. But when God and Guns come together in the public sector, when war is declared in God's name, when the rights of women are denied in his name, that is the end of separation of church and state and the undoing of everything America has ever tried to be.
I write to my sisters. I write because I believe we hold this election in our hands. This vote is a vote that will determine the future not just of the U.S. , but of the planet. It will determine whether we create policies to save the earth or make it forever uninhabitable for humans. It will determine whether we move towards dialogue and diplomacy in the world or whether we escalate violence through invasion, undermining and attack. It will determine whether we go for oil, strip mining, coal burning or invest our money in alternatives that will free us from dependency and destruction. It will determine if money gets spent on education and healthcare or whether we build more and more methods of killing. It will determine whether America is a free open tolerant society or a closed place of fear, fundamentalism and aggression.
If the Polar Bears don't move you to go and do everything in your power to get Obama elected then consider the chant that filled the hall after Palin spoke at the RNC, "Drill Drill Drill." I think of teeth when I think of drills. I think of rape. I think of destruction. I think of domination. I think of military exercises that force mindless repetition, emptying the brain of analysis, doubt, ambiguity or dissent. I think of pain.
Do we want a future of drilling? More holes in the ozone, in the floor of the sea, more holes in our thinking, in the trust between nations and peoples, more holes in the fabric of this precious thing we call life?
Eve Ensler
September 5, 2008
He told me that while he did not think McCain would win this, that the polls are the popular vote not the electoral vote where Obama is still leading, he is afraid there is an outside chance that Obama may lose primarily because he is African-American or Black. There are quite a few working class middle Americans out there from small towns, who no matter how bad things get, how poor they are, would never in a million years vote for an African-American ('Negro') for President. I pray this isn't true, but I read this morning in the paper, how NY's first African-American Governor, David Patterson, saw racism implicit not advert, but implicit in Sarah Palin's speechs and between the lines. And yes, I see it too. Sarah is like a lot of small town white Americans - who have lived in one place their entire lives and never interacted with a diverse group of people - she's Archie Bunker from All in the Family. Say what you will about Norman Lear but he nailed middle American white bigotry and it has not disappeared.
That said? This election is a positive one. It is the first time in US History that two women, and a black man ran as viable candidates for President. Not only that, they got more attention than the White Guys. That's major. It gives me hope that maybe we are beginning to move away from the old boys club. Regardless of the outcome - the fact that a woman and a black man ran as viable candidates - and one of them will either be President or in line for President of the US, when just a few decades ago neither had the right to vote - is something to celebrate and worth remembering.
Anywho - got this from another friend via email tonight:
Eve Ensler, the American playwright, performer, feminist and activist best known for "The Vagina Monologues", wrote the following about Sarah Palin.
___________________________________
Drill, Drill, Drill
I am having Sarah Palin nightmares. I dreamt last night that she was a member of a club where they rode snowmobiles and wore the claws of drowned and starved polar bears around their necks. I have a particular thing for Polar Bears. Maybe it's their snowy whiteness or their bigness or the fact that they live in the arctic or that I have never seen one in person or touched one. Maybe it is the fact that they live so comfortably on ice. Whatever it is, I need the polar bears.
I don't like raging at women. I am a Feminist and have spent my life trying to build community, help empower women and stop violence against them. It is hard to write about Sarah Palin. This is why the Sarah Palin choice was all the more insidious and cynical. The people who made this choice count on the goodness and solidarity of Feminists.
But everything Sarah Palin believes in and practices is antithetical to Feminism which for me is part of one story -- connected to saving the earth, ending racism, empowering women, giving young girls options, opening our minds, deepening tolerance, and ending violence and war.
I believe that the McCain/Palin ticket is one of the most dangerous choices of my lifetime, and should this country chose those candidates the fall-out may be so great, the destruction so vast in so many areas that America may never recover. But what is equally disturbing is the impact that duo would have on the rest of the world. Unfortunately, this is not a joke. In my lifetime I have seen the clownish, the inept, the bizarre be elected to the presidency with regularity.
Sarah Palin does not believe in evolution. I take this as a metaphor. In her world and the world of Fundamentalists nothing changes or gets better or evolves. She does not believe in global warming. The melting of the arctic, the storms that are destroying our cities, the pollution and rise of cancers, are all part of God's plan. She is fighting to take the polar bears off the endangered species list. The earth, in Palin's view, is here to be taken and plundered. The wolves and the bears are here to be shot and plundered. The oil is here to be taken and plundered. Iraq is here to be taken and plundered. As she said herself of the Iraqi war, "It was a task from God."
Sarah Palin does not believe in abortion. She does not believe women who are raped and incested and ripped open against their will should have a right to determine whether they have their rapist's baby or not.
She obviously does not believe in sex education or birth control. I imagine her daughter was practicing abstinence and we know how many babies that makes.
Sarah Palin does not much believe in thinking. From what I gather she has tried to ban books from the library, has a tendency to dispense with people who think independently. She cannot tolerate an environment of ambiguity and difference. This is a woman who could and might very well be the next president of the United States . She would govern one of the most diverse populations on the earth.
Sarah believes in guns. She has her own custom Austrian hunting rifle. She has been known to kill 40 caribou at a clip. She has shot hundreds of wolves from the air.
Sarah believes in God. That is of course her right, her private right. But when God and Guns come together in the public sector, when war is declared in God's name, when the rights of women are denied in his name, that is the end of separation of church and state and the undoing of everything America has ever tried to be.
I write to my sisters. I write because I believe we hold this election in our hands. This vote is a vote that will determine the future not just of the U.S. , but of the planet. It will determine whether we create policies to save the earth or make it forever uninhabitable for humans. It will determine whether we move towards dialogue and diplomacy in the world or whether we escalate violence through invasion, undermining and attack. It will determine whether we go for oil, strip mining, coal burning or invest our money in alternatives that will free us from dependency and destruction. It will determine if money gets spent on education and healthcare or whether we build more and more methods of killing. It will determine whether America is a free open tolerant society or a closed place of fear, fundamentalism and aggression.
If the Polar Bears don't move you to go and do everything in your power to get Obama elected then consider the chant that filled the hall after Palin spoke at the RNC, "Drill Drill Drill." I think of teeth when I think of drills. I think of rape. I think of destruction. I think of domination. I think of military exercises that force mindless repetition, emptying the brain of analysis, doubt, ambiguity or dissent. I think of pain.
Do we want a future of drilling? More holes in the ozone, in the floor of the sea, more holes in our thinking, in the trust between nations and peoples, more holes in the fabric of this precious thing we call life?
Eve Ensler
September 5, 2008
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2008-09-11 12:17 pm (UTC)But I was referring to the logic in the post I commented on. Though I see, now that it's morning, that my reference to "political analysis" is easy to misconstrue. And you might have thought I was speaking more widely than that. I should have used a more specific referent.
Thank for responding, in return some clarifications
Date: 2008-09-11 10:17 pm (UTC)I am sorry I was unable to respond to you earlier - work prohibits it and the small/quick responses I do make were made either first thing this morning or at lunch.
You are of course owed a response. Especially since, I think you misinterpreted some of the things I said or rather the meaning behind them. Also, and this unfortunately is the nature of corresponding on the internet - we have a tendency to make assumptions about others based primarily on what we see in their posts. Which is the reason I asked if you had read my other posts on the topic.
I want to make it crystal clear that I nor the man I was speaking to last night, who happens to be my father who is 72 years of age, believe that "every" person who votes for McCain is doing so because they cannot handle a black man in the Presidency. This is of course ridiculous, not to mention illogical. Nor do I believe I said that in the post above but, I can see how you may have interpreted it that way. I have a friend who is African-American and is most likely voting for John McCain or she was in January, not sure what she's doing now. She did not vote for Bush, Jr. And she loved Bush, Sr. for much the same reasons she loves McCain, I suspect. And in law school, I was friends with another extreemly conservative African-American, who similarily supported Bob Dole. So, you see, not as insular in my own party as you may think. In fact, in my lifetime - I've know and interacted with more Republicans and Conservatives than Liberal Democrats. As have my parents. About 80% of my extended family is Republican.
Nor do I believe that you are racist for supporting the McCain/Palin ticket. The people I was talking about I'm not sure you have met, but I have, are not from urban areas, and have lived their entire lives in the same place. Those who have traveled - have visited friends or traveled with friends to places on organized tours - they have not interacted with the locals. Several are members of my own family and quite a few I went to high school and law school with, and they have never to my knowledge known a black person outside of the guy that raped and murdered their cousin or mugged their parents or was the poor and somewhat messy family that kept to themselves next door. This of course has caused them to have somewhat "narrow" view of the world around them. A woman, my own grandmother, whom I love beyond imagining, is, I'm sorry to say, racist. She is like Archie Bunker and at 90 she is not going to change. Her next door neighbor, a lovely woman, who I adore and still calls her - is also racist. And yes, they are products of their upbringing and environement. This is a fact.
What you do not know about me is I spent 17 years of my life in Kansas, and 4 in Colorado Springs, plus 11 in West Chester County, PA - living amongst fairly conservative people, the majority of which do and always have been part of the Republican Party. They were from all walks of life. I have known dirt poor, lower middle class, middle class, upper middle, to rich. I went to a conservative law school - and was close friends with a gun dealer. In College, I went to a Reagan rally with a supporter of Reagan who had tears in her eyes when she saw him in person. She was one of my close friends and her father died in a private plane crash - she was incredibly wealthy and very prejudiced not necessarily racist, but certainly prejudiced, as was a woman who was gay and pro-life and incredibly conservative, but not racist in the least.
My parents live in Hilton Head, SC - which is mainly populated by conservative right-wing Republicans from Long Island, NY.
In short, I am hardly insular.
Pagilla & Palin
Date: 2008-09-11 11:27 pm (UTC)I disagree with Pagilla. The leafy suburbs of Philadelphia are hardly mainstream America. It is what my family, who live in PA, scoffingly would call Main Line Philly. In short - Pagilla lives in PA's version of Scarsdale and WestChester, NY. Rich people. Extreemly rich people. Who are not worrying about foreclosures, lost jobs, and food stamps.
I have family in PA, who live in Allen Town, Palmerton, Chester County, and unlike Pagilla, I've lived in places that are a bit more like Wassilla, Alaska. And well, I spent my childhood in Chester County, PA.
Re Palin: Have you checked the population of Alaska recently? It is 790,000. The population of the town in which Palin grew up? Anywhere between 9,000 and 5,000. To put this into perspective, this is about the same size as a lot of NY Schools. NYC has 8 million. The Philadephia Suburbs have a lot more people than Wassila. Philly is a big city. It's a lot bigger than Kansas City and Topeka. And Main Line Philly has about the same population as well WestChester, NY. It's a lot bigger than say Beacon, NY - where my brother lives. A small working class town in the Hudson River Valler that is slowly becoming gentrified.
Palin has readily admitted that she has not been outside her own state very often. I have seen more of the world and interacted with more people than this woman has. And that by itself, scares me. It should scare you. Why? Because of what you accused me of above - being so inside my own party, so insular, that I can't see any other point of view. Those remarks actually describe Sarah Palin far better than they describe me or anyone who has posted in my lj or on lj that I have seen to date. Sarah from what I've read, got married at 18, eloped, had five kids, joined City Council, became Mayor, became Governor and ran a small business. She obtained a communications degree - have you met communications majors? One of my close friends in law school was one, amazing at litigation. She knew how to present herself, how to spin things. As you know from watching Obama, who also presents himself well - except I see substance there and unlike Palin or McCain - Obama is not as insular. He has worked with the urban inner city kids, lived in Indonesia, been to Kenya to visit family, and worked both in the State Senate and the US Senate - seeing first hand the difference between State and Federal Government - and there is a BIG difference. He has also traveled extensively, around the world, around the US, interacting with a diverse group of people. Sarah has not. Biden, on the other hand, certainly has - Biden has met with world leaders, negotiated deals with world leaders, and formed foreign policy. Biden has lived in small town in Delawar and worked in DC. He has also campaigned for President and ran a campaign, which is not an easy thing to do.
My question to you regarding Palin and it is a valid one, considering McCain is 72 years of age, do you really think this woman can do a treaty with China? Or with Russia? OR discuss the intricacies of nuclear war? Do you trust her on that level? I don't. The idea of Sarah Palin as President or VP to me is an asburd joke that I might see on South Park or a parody or a Disney Movie. The fact it is not a joke and could become reality scares me. I wish McCain chose Lieberman or Condelez-Rice, both of whom, I could live with. Palin gives me nightmares.
Re: Pagilla & Palin
Date: 2008-09-14 01:39 am (UTC)Paglia's not extremely rich, or even rich - she's a professor - middle class at best.
Re Palin: Have you checked the population of Alaska recently? It is 790,000. The population of the town in which Palin grew up? Anywhere between 9,000 and 5,000.
I certainly know the population of Wasilla by this point. It's been all over the news. Hard to miss.
I have seen more of the world and interacted with more people than this woman has.
You may have seen more - but interacted with more - how could you possible know that, given her current CV? That's just an assumption on your part. For instance, I went to a large NYC high school - but that doesn't mean I interacted with everyone there. Political people are, for the most part, by nature extroverts who interact with many people all across the board.
And that by itself, scares me. It should scare you. Why?
Thanks for the advice, but it doesn't.
BTW, isn't the transmission of this meme the politics of fear - only, you know, it's the right and their agenda that's scary. All parts of what Paglia defined as the left's current manichaeism. (http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/2008/09/10/palin/index2.html)
As you know from watching Obama, who also presents himself well - except I see substance there and unlike Palin or McCain - Obama is not as insular.
I find him fairly insular - he's all about the rhetoric about crossing political lines - but he never does it. Unlike McCain, who has a track record of disturbing his own side intensely for doing so. As far as I can make out, with Obama, it's all talk. Moreover, I think he's spent the last years hiding his actual ideas and political proclivities from the public, because what he really thinks would prove too unpopular.
I wish McCain chose Lieberman or Condelez-Rice, both of whom, I could live with.
Why would he? He would have lost decisively. It would have been a very poor strategic decision. Not generally considered an admirable practical trait. Even if it was high minded.
Personally, I wouldn't have minded Lieberman, but I'm fairly sick of Rice by this point. I don't think her diplomacy is particularly effective. Moreover, she's been in high office for 8 years already and has expressed no desire for the position. There's also a reason there's such a high turnover in high government posts, and that's because the job is exhausting.
My question to you regarding Palin and it is a valid one, considering McCain is 72 years of age, do you really think this woman can do a treaty with China? Or with Russia?
First of all, I'm not fixated on the Dem talking point that McCain is going to drop dead the minute he's elected. The man is an energizer bunny of energy. I was reading an article in Slate, I think, recently, about how Lindsey Graham was running around on the campaign trail with him, and Graham, the younger man, was exhausted by it, but not McCain. Secondly, in the off chance that McCain does die, some years after he's been in office, she'll have had plenty more experience. Thirdly, no one goes in alone to negotiate a treaty. You have a huge staff of advisers at your disposal who do the footwork for you. Fourthly, since I'm in more political agreement with her instincts than either Obama's or Biden's, I'd be far more worried about them negotiating a treaty with Russia or China. IMO, one reason Putin attacked Georgia now is that Bush is a lame duck and he thought that Obama was a sure thing for President. And he's not at all intimidated by Obama, who is a dove.
Palin gives me nightmares.
Apparently you are not alone - the people at Slate (http://www.slate.com/id/2200015/") are right there with you.
Reminds me of the fact that during the weeks after the 2000 election, shrinks in NYC (and LA, too, I imagine) were booked solidly with people having anxiety attacks.
Re: Thank for responding, in return some clarifications
Date: 2008-09-14 01:59 am (UTC)Or as you put it initially:
He told me... he is afraid there is an outside chance that Obama may lose primarily because he is African-American or Black. There are quite a few working class middle Americans out there from small towns, who no matter how bad things get, how poor they are, would never in a million years vote for an African-American ('Negro') for President.
Just wanted to point out that I never accused you of being insular - I was talking about the logic of your argument. Your analysis, etc., not you.
Re: Thank for responding, in return some clarifications
Date: 2008-09-14 03:33 am (UTC)I don't believe further discussion is going to help. Neither of us will change our minds - since we are not undecided.
I should probably tell you that Pagila is NOT a good choice - even though she supports Obama, she is actually considered a bit ...unreliable and sort of silly by a lot of people. Be sort of like quoting Madonna, who I honestly respect a lot more than Pagila. I can see why you thought otherwise, just saying it did not help your analysis.