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shadowkatI have a rather interesting and at times aggravating relationship with my younger brother.
Every Xmas and birthday, I struggle over what to get my neice, my brother and his wife. It's not as simple as one might think. My neice is 4 years old. My brother and his wife both have Masters degrees in Art, and spent a good portion of their education analyzing film and media.Specifically from a sociological and political perspective. If you give them something that they consider offensive - they will tell you, often in a patronizing and condescending tone.
It is rather annoying. They've informed my parents and myself that Disney and anything done by Disney is off-limits. My mother asked about Dumbo - which we saw as children, and my brother launched into a fifteen-twenty minute rant about the racism and violence in the film. I considered getting the film Born Free - bought it even, then quickly cancelled, after I read a plot synopsis and summary. It is to say the least, politically incorrect. The annoying thing about all of this - is my brother likes things that are politically incorrect too. He just rationalizes that they are okay, while the things I like aren't. Also, he doesn't like how I and my mother analyze things - which is from a psychological and plot perspective. We hated Titantic for example - because from a plot perspective, psychological and literary perspective - it was predictable, cliche, and somewhat hollow. Not to mention obvious. He adored it - because from a design, production, style, and sociological/political perspective it was interesting.
My mother once made the mistake of taking my brother and his wife to on of her favorite musicals, something she loved and wanted to share with us - The Fantastiks . They walked out in the middle of it, and ranted for twenty minutes about the political incorrectness of the musical - how it had a rape, and was offensive and misogynistic. My poor mother was in tears. And I was furious at them, for being self-righteous, patronizing jerks.
Granted The Fantastiks does have some rather weird bits, it's a weird musical, very ironic, and if you view it from a psychological perspective, fascinating. It's about the human condition, the dark side of our nature, our hopes and dreams and nightmares. It's also at times, an anti-romance. I understood why my mother liked it, and why my brother and his wife hated it.
What annoyed me is why my brother could not understand what my parents saw in it. Instead of judging them and it, he refused to see it from another perspective. Theirs. He refused to put himself in their point of view, instead he judged them, he made assumptions. Not realizing that they may not be looking at the play from the same perspective. Or see the things he saw in it. I can see where he's coming from. But I disagree with the attitude that the play should only be judged or critiqued on that criteria. I don't believe the world or art is that starkly black and white. It's grey. And its not that simply resolved. Also I think we project our own issues and our own experience onto things, often without realizing it. Then are shocked when someone else sees it completely differently. Like I've said before, my brother and I are opposites. Yet we share the same DNA, the same upbringing, and the similar childhood educations.
In a way - I prefer the politically incorrect - because it is more honest. What we say is not the same as what we do. And it is easier to combat prejudice if someone reveals it, then if they don't for fear of being slapped upside the head. Not to mention the fact that it helps to understand where that person is coming from, why they feel that way, and to know that is just a smidgen of who they are, it does not define them. Art is one way of understanding how people feel about things. If we only focus on the parts that offend us, we never can understand why the person created the art - we miss out. My brother appears to want to remove it or condemn the offending object - almost as if - that object did not exist - then neither would the things he associates with it. A sort of censorship if you will, which is ironic, because he is an artist and has fought censorship his whole life. I may be wrong about that, I am, I admit, at times as guilty if not more so of making assumptions regarding him. The assumptions are what stands in our way of understanding each other. They always do. And I admit, I have at times, in this very journal, deleted or thrown out an offending object because I did not wish to look on it. I wonder sometimes if that is a human response.
In case you think I'm being hypocritical here and perhaps I am, I admit, I have been guilty of blasting things from a political or sociological perspective. Every time I do it I come across as self-righteous and am embarrassed and hate myself a bit for it afterwards. It is not a trait I find attractive in myself and as a result, intolerable at times in others. And I fear I may be coming across that way now. That's the problem with sociological and political analysis - it tends to be emotionally charged.
Without further ado, here is the meme, assuming you've made it this far, aren't incredibly put off or just plain bored
*Come up with five, if you can, politically incorrect favorite characters or tv shows that have fandoms. They can be an episode, a character or an entire series. Each must be politically or sociologically incorrect - by that I mean, that someone in the fandom, usually more than one person, has criticized the character or show or episode - stating that it is offensive to minorities, women, etc. That it is misogynistic. Or it is anti-gay. Or racist. And implying, whether intentionally or not, usually not, that you, or anyone for that matter, by loving this thing are by association perpetuating that offense.
[ETA: To clarify - you can choose any five media centric things - such as entertainers, comedians, tv shows, films, books, comics, etc, more if you can think of them, or less if you can't that you love and have been perceived as "politically incorrect or offensive" by someone else. ]
Here's the Five I came up with off the top of my head, not as easy as it looks, I sort of drew a blank. This is the reason I don't do memes. I more often draw a blank. Therefore am changing the rules. Just list as many as you can come up with.:
1. Spike - a character from Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Angel the Series.
2. Supernatural - a noir tv series featuring two brothers who fight monsters.
3. Lies My Parents Told Me - an episode of Buffy the Vampire Slayer (which I adore from a psychological and plot perspective)
4. BattleStar Galatica Version 2 - specifically the episode "Pegasus" - which starred Michelle Forbes.
5. Firefly
Every Xmas and birthday, I struggle over what to get my neice, my brother and his wife. It's not as simple as one might think. My neice is 4 years old. My brother and his wife both have Masters degrees in Art, and spent a good portion of their education analyzing film and media.Specifically from a sociological and political perspective. If you give them something that they consider offensive - they will tell you, often in a patronizing and condescending tone.
It is rather annoying. They've informed my parents and myself that Disney and anything done by Disney is off-limits. My mother asked about Dumbo - which we saw as children, and my brother launched into a fifteen-twenty minute rant about the racism and violence in the film. I considered getting the film Born Free - bought it even, then quickly cancelled, after I read a plot synopsis and summary. It is to say the least, politically incorrect. The annoying thing about all of this - is my brother likes things that are politically incorrect too. He just rationalizes that they are okay, while the things I like aren't. Also, he doesn't like how I and my mother analyze things - which is from a psychological and plot perspective. We hated Titantic for example - because from a plot perspective, psychological and literary perspective - it was predictable, cliche, and somewhat hollow. Not to mention obvious. He adored it - because from a design, production, style, and sociological/political perspective it was interesting.
My mother once made the mistake of taking my brother and his wife to on of her favorite musicals, something she loved and wanted to share with us - The Fantastiks . They walked out in the middle of it, and ranted for twenty minutes about the political incorrectness of the musical - how it had a rape, and was offensive and misogynistic. My poor mother was in tears. And I was furious at them, for being self-righteous, patronizing jerks.
Granted The Fantastiks does have some rather weird bits, it's a weird musical, very ironic, and if you view it from a psychological perspective, fascinating. It's about the human condition, the dark side of our nature, our hopes and dreams and nightmares. It's also at times, an anti-romance. I understood why my mother liked it, and why my brother and his wife hated it.
What annoyed me is why my brother could not understand what my parents saw in it. Instead of judging them and it, he refused to see it from another perspective. Theirs. He refused to put himself in their point of view, instead he judged them, he made assumptions. Not realizing that they may not be looking at the play from the same perspective. Or see the things he saw in it. I can see where he's coming from. But I disagree with the attitude that the play should only be judged or critiqued on that criteria. I don't believe the world or art is that starkly black and white. It's grey. And its not that simply resolved. Also I think we project our own issues and our own experience onto things, often without realizing it. Then are shocked when someone else sees it completely differently. Like I've said before, my brother and I are opposites. Yet we share the same DNA, the same upbringing, and the similar childhood educations.
In a way - I prefer the politically incorrect - because it is more honest. What we say is not the same as what we do. And it is easier to combat prejudice if someone reveals it, then if they don't for fear of being slapped upside the head. Not to mention the fact that it helps to understand where that person is coming from, why they feel that way, and to know that is just a smidgen of who they are, it does not define them. Art is one way of understanding how people feel about things. If we only focus on the parts that offend us, we never can understand why the person created the art - we miss out. My brother appears to want to remove it or condemn the offending object - almost as if - that object did not exist - then neither would the things he associates with it. A sort of censorship if you will, which is ironic, because he is an artist and has fought censorship his whole life. I may be wrong about that, I am, I admit, at times as guilty if not more so of making assumptions regarding him. The assumptions are what stands in our way of understanding each other. They always do. And I admit, I have at times, in this very journal, deleted or thrown out an offending object because I did not wish to look on it. I wonder sometimes if that is a human response.
In case you think I'm being hypocritical here and perhaps I am, I admit, I have been guilty of blasting things from a political or sociological perspective. Every time I do it I come across as self-righteous and am embarrassed and hate myself a bit for it afterwards. It is not a trait I find attractive in myself and as a result, intolerable at times in others. And I fear I may be coming across that way now. That's the problem with sociological and political analysis - it tends to be emotionally charged.
Without further ado, here is the meme, assuming you've made it this far, aren't incredibly put off or just plain bored
*Come up with five, if you can, politically incorrect favorite characters or tv shows that have fandoms. They can be an episode, a character or an entire series. Each must be politically or sociologically incorrect - by that I mean, that someone in the fandom, usually more than one person, has criticized the character or show or episode - stating that it is offensive to minorities, women, etc. That it is misogynistic. Or it is anti-gay. Or racist. And implying, whether intentionally or not, usually not, that you, or anyone for that matter, by loving this thing are by association perpetuating that offense.
[ETA: To clarify - you can choose any five media centric things - such as entertainers, comedians, tv shows, films, books, comics, etc, more if you can think of them, or less if you can't that you love and have been perceived as "politically incorrect or offensive" by someone else. ]
Here's the Five I came up with off the top of my head, not as easy as it looks, I sort of drew a blank. This is the reason I don't do memes. I more often draw a blank. Therefore am changing the rules. Just list as many as you can come up with.:
1. Spike - a character from Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Angel the Series.
2. Supernatural - a noir tv series featuring two brothers who fight monsters.
3. Lies My Parents Told Me - an episode of Buffy the Vampire Slayer (which I adore from a psychological and plot perspective)
4. BattleStar Galatica Version 2 - specifically the episode "Pegasus" - which starred Michelle Forbes.
5. Firefly
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no subject
Date: 2009-01-25 06:05 pm (UTC)Otherwise, well said. And as for DNA and brothers: I am a nontheist, and my brother is an evangelical Christian, even though we share DNA and both went through 12 years of Catholic school. Go figure.
no subject
Date: 2009-01-25 09:02 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-01-28 08:00 am (UTC)2. Michael Weston on Burn Notice (he is a paranoid ex-spy who can be VERY incorrect)
3. Logan on Veronica Mars (rich spoiled bad boy, wasting his life, and yet I love him)
4. Stephen Colbert on the Colbert Report
5. House on House (pill popping doctor who hates everyone, surely he counts!)
I have to say that I would have listed characters from Buffy, Angel & Firefly, because I love them all and most of them are politically incorrect in different ways... but you had those covered, and of course BSG too....
My older sister always zeroed in on the marginal characters, the anti-heroes, or even the villains if they were conflicted or sufficiently layered... so she taught me to look at characters from a different angle, and be open to what even the strangest/weirdest characters had to offer (ie Peter Lorre in almost anything! He should be on my list).
Calvin (see icon) should be on my list too.
I'm sorry you Mom had to go through that w/your brother & sister-in-law, that really seems like an over reaction to what is clearly just a silly musical comedy ... I've always loved the music to 'The Fantastics' and always wished I got to see it on stage.
no subject
Date: 2009-01-28 05:53 pm (UTC)For my own choices - on each and every one of them, I've either had an emotionally charged/vehement debate on the character or show - that more often than not dissolved into name-calling or I've read rants about it other's lj's or on fanboards.
Firefly - it was the entire series. Some fans really objected to the content, claiming it was misogynistic in tone (actually I think they were confusing misogyny with chauvinism, but that's being nitpicky).
Spike - well you've seen that for yourself, ;-)
BSG - Pegasus - the episode with Michelle Forbes that aired about two years back? Highly controversial. Actually the series is - in that it really pushes some people's buttons.
Supernatural - even more so than BSG. It is very noir, almost pure noir. And has a very "redneck" feel to it. The fanbase - which I'm not a part of and have never really seen, stayed far away - has put people off of the series. This happens alot with cult tv shows, apparently. I've lost count of the number of rants or emotionally charged threads on this topic.
All similar to my experience with the Fantastiks with my kidbrother. To be fair to my brother - my mother told me that she had misread his interests, ignoring the fact that neither nor his wife enjoyed plays or musicals. They like bands, live music, or performance art - but traditional theater, musicals, turns them off. They aren't interested in the story so much as in the manner in which it is presented and it's themes. While I'm the opposite, I don't care about it's themes or how it is presented, it can be a bare bones stage with a bunch of people reading from a script - as long as it is a good story with good characters then I'm there. For them, the story could be amazing, it could have great characters - but if the presentation isn't cool and stylish or fits their standards, they are out of there.
That said, I've learned that if I'm "overly" emotionally invested in something - I should not discuss it with someone who has a polar pov and equally emotionally invested in that pov. Neither of us can be objective and we end up just screaming at each other or making cutting remarks - which is counter-productive. Politically incorrect items often will cause that conflict to happen more than anything else - at least online, where the conversation is limited to what you can type onto a screen or put in an icon.