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[shadowkat]

1) Book Meme: Day 19 – Favorite book turned into a movie

I'm behind, this I know. Eh...it's hard to adapt the books into movies, they are never going to be exactly what you saw when reading the book. An Aunt of mine refuses to watch movies that have been adapted from books that she loves - because when she reads, she watches the book play out like a movie in her head - and the adaptation never quite fits what was in her head - it's always wrong. Nor does she want to see the movie before reading the book - because that ruins it for her as well.

I'm not that picky. I'm willing to hand-wave the discrepancies, or I basically look at it as another person's interpretation. And I find other interpretations of what I love fascinating.
No-one else is in my head after-all, including the writer. I can hardly expect them to have interpreted the book or art the same way I have. When they do, I'm flabbergasted and that is just, well brilliant.

So..favorite book turned into a movie is either one in which I can't remember the book that well and the movie captured what I do remember or loved about it, or it totally fit what was in my head. And don't ask me to pick just one, dammit.

* Fellowship of the Ring by JRR Tolkien and Peter Jackson. Perfectly captured my love of the book, and in some ways I liked the movie better. I'm guessing I may well be in the minority on this - from what I've seen on my flist. But mileage, it varies, that's the fun.

* A&E's presentation of the BBC minseries of Pride and Prejudice - which in some respects actually improved on the Jane Austen novel.

I'd say The Hunger Games...but, eh, it's flawed. In some respects I liked the book better.

And definitely Game of Thrones...although I like the tv series better than the books, and yes, I know, most likely in the minority on that one as well.

None of the Whedon finales really felt like finales, except possibly for the flick Serenity.
Buffy had a couple of hanging plot threads, Angel did too - yet oddly, I preferred that finale to all the others - it was the most satisfying to me for some reason. Don't ask me why, I've no clue. But out of all Whedon's series for some bizarre reason - I liked the Angel series finale "Not Fade Away" the best - it worked for me, it was in character, fit the story-thread, and fit the genre/trope. I was actually relieved they did it that way.
anything else most likely would have annoyed me. This may explain why the Angel comics don't work for me...I felt Angel's arc was concluded best by the tv series.


Day 20 – Favorite romance book
Day 21 – Favorite book from your childhood
Day 22 – Favorite book you own
Day 23 – A book you wanted to read for a long time but still haven’t
Day 24 – A book that you wish more people have read
Day 25 – A character who you can relate to the most
Day 26 – A book that changed your opinion about something
Day 27 – The most surprising plot twist or ending
Day 28 – Favorite title
Day 29 – A book everyone hated but you liked
Day 30 – Your favorite book of all time


2.TV MEme: Day 22 - Favorite series finale

I'm not really sure I have one. TV series usually suck at this sort of thing, it goes against the grain.

The Wire by far was the best - it wrapped up all the loose threads and provided a satisfying sense of closure. I didn't need any more episodes.

Peace-keeper Wars - was also a satisfying conclusion to Farscape - it gave me everything I needed and yet, left the story open at the same time.

Star Trek Next Generations Finale - where Picard goes forward and backwards in time exploring his life and choices, was a fascinating character study and study of the series as a whole. It was a clever finale that worked. Often clever finales don't work.

And... I liked The MASH finale...which I can no longer remember the name of. Sappy, but satisfying, even if it went on too long.


Day 23 - Most annoying character
Day 24 - Best quote
Day 25 - A show you plan on watching (old or new)
Day 26 - OMG WTF? Season finale
Day 27 - Best pilot episode
Day 28 - First TV show obsession
Day 29 - Current TV show obsession
Day 30 - Saddest character death.


3. Slowly making my way through Dance of Dragons. The problem with Martin, is he has so many characters that I'll forget them in the space between books and it may take me a while to figure out who the heck this person is. Current chapter I'm reading...appears to feature a new point of view, Quentin of Dorn. So I'm thinking, wait, who is Quentin? He sounds familiar. I know I should remember him. Five to six pages in, it hits me, oh, right,


The King/Prince of Dorn's son who he sent off to marry Daenerys - in order to form an alliance to take down Stannis and the Lannisters. It took a while to remember that plot-thread.

Frigging writer isn't satisfied with just doing the same pov's book to book, no he has to create ten new povs, just to confuse me. I wander along and think, wait, who is this person? Oh...they were a minor character that was mentioned off-hand way back in Book 4 or 3. Got it.

Sigh... You shouldn't need a chart or rollerdex to keep track of all the characters, not quite sure how he does this - man must have a mind like an index (despite what you may think - I don't). If I were writing this thing - I'd have gotten lost a long time ago.

Back somewhat better, but still keeping lap-top usage down.

Why is it as I get older, I find it harder and harder to focus on stuff and want to read the literary equivalent of Peeps? No, I'm not talking about GRR Martin, GRR Martin is the literary equivalent of a very rich five course meal in which you either want to go to sleep after wards or feel like you are about to explode from eating too damn much.

Comments

[sophist.livejournal.com]

Martin seems to expect that readers will obsess over his books. Nothing wrong with that; hard core fans of most works do (and who am I to criticize, given Buffy?). But it sure makes the first read awfully difficult.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Yeah, see that's my problem with the books - you shouldn't have to re-read them. If the writer can't get across his message in the first read-through, he's doing something wrong. (Granted I feel this way partly because I read legalese and railroad-ese (which is even worse) for a living and you can't understand that in the first read through, let alone the second half the time. No offense, but lawyers and engineers aren't necessarily always the best communicators in the universe. Currently I'm wrestling with the frigging NY STate SAFE ACT, which made Martin relatively easy going and all our debates about racism in Buffy rather pale in comparison.)

This may explain my need for the literary equivalent of "peeps" at the moment, sugary, no nutritional value whatsoever, and simple writing.

[sophist.livejournal.com]

The one thing I can say on Martin's behalf is that re-reading the books does pay. But I agree with you on the fundamental point -- it shouldn't be that hard to follow the basic plot. It's one thing to get more out of a re-read by noticing metaphors or subtle prophecies, or whatever. But the basic plot should be easy to follow.

[kathyh]

I haven't read Dance with Dragons yet. I can't quite face the amount of rereading I would need to do to remember who people like Quentin of Dorne are!

If I were writing this thing - I'd have gotten lost a long time ago.

Are we sure he hasn't? I can't see how he's going to tie things up in the last two books as I'm sure it was originally only going to be seven books. Now new plot threads seem to be appearing all the time and I wonder if that's because he's forgotten the old ones. I'm not totally serious about that...or am I.

I agree about the Angel finale. For a series that I would have preferred to see continued it ended well.

[flameraven.livejournal.com]

He does manage to tie up a number of threads in Dance with Dragons, so I believe that he can finish the series in the last two books.

Though, considering that the tentative title for Book 6 is something like 'the Wolves of Winter' or 'The Winds of Winter', I suspect that in true GRRM style, a lot of resolution will come because people will die.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I will be surprised if the Lannisters make it to the end of the series. I figure the Stark kids are safe, the writer seems to have a soft spot for them and at times this feels like an overly violent kid's coming of age tale.

[flameraven.livejournal.com]

Pretty sure the only Lannister making it out of these books is Tyrion. And even then I'd say his survival chances are only, hm, 75% at best.

Only people who will fare worse than the Lannisters will be the Freys.

I think most of the Stark kids will be okay, except for possibly Bran, who... I don't think he'll die, but I feel like he'll end up in a situation chasing these visions of his that will possibly be very weird?

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Does Rickon ever show up again? I'd forgotten he went off with the other group until someone reminded me.

Shame about the Lannisters, I actually like Jamie and Tyrion better than most of the Starks...although the Starks are growing on me. Jon is far more likeable in this book than he was in Game of Thrones or Clash of Kings, where I just wanted to smack him upside the head, same with Sansa...who seems to just blindly trust all the wrong people, yet somehow survives.

Right now I'm not so sure about Tyrion, except I know the author has a soft spot for the character - which bodes well for him. Jamie, however, I think will be toast in the next book - I also think he may well end up being the one who kills Cersei - assuming she survives Dance of Dragons. Mainly because Jamie and Cersei killing each other would be ironic.

[flameraven.livejournal.com]

Rickon hasn't shown up directly, although I heard there's a mention of him in DwD? I missed it though and only heard about it later, so I think it's fairly subtle.

I feel like Jaime has the option of redemption, but even if he survives the events of the book, would probably be executed by whoever ends up in power. Cersei too.

Sansa I just feel really bad for. She was a foolish child (remember, she's only 11 in the beginning of the books) who got a very harsh reality check and then ended up in a terrible abusive situation with no way out. I kind of hope she kills Littlefinger in the end for being super creepy, and then becomes badass and takes over the Eyrie. I feel like she's been growing stronger, but she has to hide it under so many layers of artifice it's hard to see. (Which is of course the point.)

Yeah, Tyrion sort of became the Main Character, not that that makes him any safer in a GRRM book. But I think he has a chance. Especially if he meets up with Daenerys, who is my guess as the eventual 'winner' of the books.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

I feel like Jaime has the option of redemption, but even if he survives the events of the book, would probably be executed by whoever ends up in power. Cersei too.

Either that or a zombie/wight.


Rickon hasn't shown up directly, although I heard there's a mention of him in DwD? I missed it though and only heard about it later, so I think it's fairly subtle.

You really can't skim or scan these books, can you? He has this tendency to bury plot points and important characters in seemingly meaningless passages - like a long winding conversation during a sumptuous meal.

Such as Quentin. That plot point was revealed in such a passage. Luckily it was revealed twice. Or I would have forgotten it.

I kind of hope she kills Littlefinger in the end for being super creepy, and then becomes badass and takes over the Eyrie.

Been rooting for the same thing. Will state that at least Littlefinger is interesting, he's sort of the evil version of Tyrion. Clever like Tyrion, but far more demented.

Yeah, Tyrion sort of became the Main Character, not that that makes him any safer in a GRRM book. But I think he has a chance. Especially if he meets up with Daenerys, who is my guess as the eventual 'winner' of the books.

I've decided that Tyrion, Daenerys, Ayra, and Jon Snow are the lead protagonists/heroes of these books...although I could be wrong about that.

[flameraven.livejournal.com]

I'm glad that they're playing up Littlefinger's creepiness in the show. Because dude, being so obsessed with your childhood sweetheart that you then become intent on sexing up her daughter? Very very creepy. Ugh.

I do think that Sansa already is kind of badass in the way she plays the game and makes certain that everyone thinks she is harmless, quiet, just a lost little bird. The problem is that she has no leverage and no one on her side, so she can't use this skill at deception in any way. If she'd managed to marry into the Tyrells, maybe she'd have had a better chance. Granmama Tyrell is pretty amazingly badass in her own right.

I do really want that awful kid in the Eyrie to fall off the tower, though.

I think you're right about the main characters. There's a lot of speculation that Daenerys and possibly Jon Snow are two of the "three heads of the dragon" that keep getting mentioned. Tyrion, I think, has some important purpose in the grander scheme of things, though I'm not sure what. Arya, I think, will be the one who brings the Starks together again to reap vengeance. I mean, Martin has certainly hit us over the head enough times about how powerful a metaphor the direwolves are, and of the wolves, Arya's is the one that's currently leading a massive wolf pack numbering in the hundreds that's ravaging the riverlands. If that's not significant symbolism I don't know what is.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Well it did help that I only finished reading Feast of Crows five months ago.
So I still remember the Princess of Dorn plot thread - where the princess attempts to steal Myrcella and put Myrcella on the Iron Throne, but is thwarted by her father, who is plotting to have Quentyn (the Princess's brother) marry Daenrys Tarragryn and they can take their revenge on Tywin Lannister and the Queen.

Shame news travels so slowly in Westeros...because he needn't have bothered.
By the time Quentin gets to Daenrys - the Lannisters will most likely be all gone. Granted revenge is a dish best served cold...but don't wait too long or the enemy will be cold...and possibly a zombie by the time you get around to kicking them.

[flameraven.livejournal.com]

Actually, I think Martin has said that even he has trouble keeping track of things, and he's forced to double- and triple-check everything because he knows if some minor detail is wrong, he's going to get mobbed by obsessive fans telling him so. He's stated that the reason Dance of Dragons took so long to write was that all the characters had to be in the right place in the right time for the plot to happen, and making sure they all lined up correctly took forever.

Dance of Dragons definitely took me the longest to get through, though I didn't find it too hard to follow since I had read all four of the others directly prior. Still took me awhile, as some sections and characters are just boring. Definitely did not really like the Quention chapters at all.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Yes, Quentin is a romantic fool...I found his sister in Feast more interesting, whiny, but more interesting. Not a huge fan of the Dorn characters. I'm bogged down with Quentin at the moment and decided to take a break.

Rather liked the preceeding chapters though... they were creepy and interesting. My problem though is several end with subtle cliff-hangers...and by the time Martin gets back there, I forget what the cliff-hanger was.

I sort of wish he'd combined Dance of Dragons with Feast or that I read them at the same time - because they apparently happen concurrently. The Jon Snow chapter jarred me...took me a while to realize, wait, this is happening at the same time as the first few chapters in Feast. So the beginning chapters in Dance take place directly after the beginning chapters in Feast. In which case I've read the books wrong - apparently you should read one chapter in Feast, then jump and read a chapter in Dance. But Martin didn't publish them in that manner - instead he published Feast five to six years before we got Dance. So, if I got confused, I can only imagine how people who read Feast six years ago felt.

Weird writer.

[flameraven.livejournal.com]

I was fore-warned going into DwD about the timeline, so it didn't bother me.

Originally, Martin was going to write all the characters into one book, as he did the others. But essentially what happened is that as he wrote, the story got too long to fit in one book, and he was going to have to split the volumes to get them published. His options were include all the characters but half the story, or all the story for half the characters. He chose the latter, and then thought that he'd be able to finish up Dance that it would come out a year later, so it wouldn't matter. Then of course it took longer for him to finish than he expected, and one year turned into six. I'm sure it doesn't help that he's involved with a ton of other projects besides Game of Thrones, so his attention can't always be on writing, or can't only be on writing this series.

[shapinglight]

I've only read the first of the series and I don't plan to read any more. I found it very heavy going. Much prefer the TV series.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Considering it just gets heavier...and more violent, this may be wise. Game of Thrones is actually the lightest and most positive of the books, believe it or not. Martin is definitely a horror fantasy writer who makes Whedon look relatively chipper and light in comparison.