Once Upon a Time....tonight's episode (pardon me while I jump up and down with glee)

[shadowkat]

Once Upon a Time rocked tonight - surprise, surprise, it basically gave me everything I wanted in one episode. Amazing. And answered several questions, along with filling a few plot-holes that I never thought they'd answer.

This just does not happen on tv shows people. Normally they drag this stuff out for three episodes. Rarely do we get what we got in this one episode. (See LOST, Alias, BSG, Buffy, Angel, and pretty much everything else for examples. Not to mention S1 of Once Upon a Time.)

Am impressed. Love the episode...it satisfied all my story kinks big time. Well except for one too many commercials (evil marketing people there's no stopping them) which I could have done without and well the side story with Regina and Belle. Regina and Belle are beginning to grate on my nerves again. But the side story was minor...so we can ignore that for now.



I loved this episode. Even though I'd predicted a long time ago that Henry's father was Baelfire, the show still managed to surprise me. It did things that well tv shows just don't do. I assumed the Baelfire reveal would happen at the very end of the episode and be a cliff-hanger, not occur in the first ten minutes. Then when it did, I assumed that Rumplestilskin wouldn't get to see him and they'd go back to Storybrook. But that didn't happen. Instead, Rumple gets into Bae's apartment, and figures out Emma has been lying to him, that she is holding something back. So he threatens her, which brings Bae to her rescue.

Then I assumed that she would manage to keep Henry a secret from Bae and Rumple - but no, that got revealed to.

In addition - Emma called Snow, her Mom, to ask for advice and told Snow that Henry was Rumplestilskin's grandson. This resulted in the great exchange between Snow and Charming.

Charming: Wait, I'm Henry's grandfather.
Snow: You can have more than one.
Charming: So Rumplestilkskin is his grandfather, the Evil Queen is his stepgrandmother, and his great-grandmother...
Snow: Oh dear...
Charming: It's a good thing we don't have Thanksgiving Dinner back in our land, can you imagine the family dinner conversation -
Snow: I don't know, it might mellow everyone out.

I adore Neal Cassidy/Baelfire - mainly because I love the actor playing him, Michael Raymond-James formerly of Terriers, and also of True Blood. Everyone else can have Hook, I want Baelfire.
Speaking of...Hook is now a contract player apparently.

* We also got to find out what Neal Cassidy saw in Pinnochio's box. "I know you're Baelfire".
Interesting, wonder how Pinnochio figured that one out? I'd figured out that Pinnochio knew he was Bae, but I did not know that was what he had shown him. And yes, it was just a type-writer in the box - the metaphor of course - the most powerful magic is the weaving or typing the story. (Speaking of Pinnochio - where is August anyhow?)

I interpreted that scene fairly well - in that the expression on Bae's face appeared to be dismay.
And he really wants nothing to do with magic.

As his discussion with Emma reveals, where he informs her that everything about his father sucks.
But the main reason he can't quite forgive his father - is that his father abandoned him for magic, it's also why he hates magic.

* As a bonus, and I did not expect this at all...we get a bit more of Rumple's back story, such as why he limps and why he left the front. Apparently he was excited about fighting and volunteered.
But the Seer that he was told to guard, told him that if he fought, his child would be fatherless.
And we find out that Rumplestilskin's worst fear is to abandon his family - to leave them fatherless as his father abandoned him and left him fatherless. It's ironic because in a way it is what he has done to so many others - taken children from parents. It also goes to the root of the Rumplestilskin fairy tale - where Rumplestilskin wants to take the first born child from the Miller's Daughter.

Here the Miller's Daughter is Cora, and the first born child is Regina. Who he uses to unleash a curse that will take him to his son. The series of events that he causes to happen result in Henry's birth.

The Seer later tells him...that while he will be reunited with Baelfire through a boy, that boy will be his undoing. Oh, says Rumplestilskin, I'll just kill the boy. Now, he's discovered that the boy is his grandson, Bae's son.

* Emma has to struggle with Henry's anger. He accuses her of lying to him, just like Regina. Actually it isn't just like Regina. And Emma does tell him the truth, granted she's not given much choice in the matter...Rumplestilskin bullies her into it and neither Rumple nor Bae are stupid.

I loved how that played out. Emma obviously still harbors feelings for Neal Cassidy/Baelfire just as Baelfire harbors feelings for her - and they have Henry. And they are both children of Fairytale land characters, but not affected by the curse.

* We also learn that Cora, Regina, and Hook are unaffected by the curse and can leave Storybrook without losing their memories. But as Regina and Cora point out - they won't have magic. Hook doesn't care - he doesn't need magic.

Although I wouldn't be so sure - Mr. Gold is a dangerous customer.

* The villains in this tale have a long way to go before being anywhere near redeemed. Regina and Rumple still only care about themselves and only care about their kids to the extent that they can possess them on their terms. Neither appears to be capable of a truly selfless act or love. They want what is best for them not their people they proclaim to love.

Rumple's scene with Baelfire is fascinating. He wants to turn back the clock.

Rumple: I can erase your memories, all the pain, he tells his son. I can make you 14 again. (I think Rumplestilskin really did think his son would still be 14 years of age. After all he hasn't really aged, why would his son? He appears a bit flabbergasted when he sees the grown man.)
Neal/Bae: No! I don't want to be 14 again. And I don't want to forget my life.
Rumple: You don't know what it is to live with regret...
Bae/Neal: Try living with abandonment.

And Bae tells Rumple what it felt like to be abandoned, to slip into the portal, and fall alone - when Rumple let go of his arm and was too cowardly to let go of his power.

Rumple was doomed to repeat his father's mistakes. He did not want to be his father, but he became his father. A self-fulfilling prophecy. By listening to his fear - he became what he feared. As the Seer states...it was inevitable.

I do have a few quibbles though...

1. Not sure I liked how Milla reacted to Rumple's return. Excuse me, the woman just had a child. Her reaction to her husband, who she allegedly loves, returning from War is contempt? She would rather have had him die in battle than be a deserter and have his son live with the shame of having a coward for a father? Is she crazy? Also it seems a bit weird, considering she tried to talk him out of going to the wars at the beginning.

Granted, it wasn't fighting that Rumple was afraid of or killing people. It was getting killed and leaving his child fatherless, abandoning his son. His greatest fear was having his son grow up without a father. Yet, his actions seem to cause that to happen anyhow. Just as the main reason he goes to fight - is because he fears becoming like his own father, a coward. He inadvertently causes both things to come true.

This is ironic...because Baelfire grows up without parents as does Emma, and Bae's actions to avoid his father - result in Henry losing them both. Instead of returning with Emma to Storybrook and confronting his father and breaking the curse...he runs instead.

2. Baelfire is angry at Emma for not telling him outright about Henry and planning on keeping Henry a secret from him. Seriously dude, Emma's right, who abandoned who here? You really have no right to whine. You do however have a lot to answer for - you left a woman pregnant with your kid to take the fall for you.

3. Henry's being a little unreasonable. But I can sort of see his point - he feels like everyone keeps things from him. OTOH, if he expects Bae to forgive Rumple and if he can forgive Regina, he should be able to let poor Emma off the hook - I'm guessing he will.

So maybe not so many quibbles?

Belle...sigh. The Belle storyline is grating. She's basically amensia girl. Didn't Regina give her a cursed identity in Storybrook? And by the way, Regina so deserves to have the real world break in on her little town and make her life a living hell. Both the Giant and know the performing of magic in Belle's room caught the other patient's attention.

Cora clearly wants power over Rumplestilskin - actually I think she just wants Rumple's power period. Regina should think twice about killing off Henry's family - Henry has an irritating habit of unearthing her lies and I can't quite decide if Henry is more annoyed by her actions or her lies. And that family's about to get a bit more complicated - I mean, not only is Henry biologically linked to Snow White and Prince Charming, he's also linked to Rumplestilskin.
Damn. Of all the kids she could have possibly adopted - Rumple gives her his own grandson, what are the odds? You gotta love the irony.

I still think there's another twist coming in the story - I think Baelfire may also be Peter Pan.
But I could be wrong. After all, he may not have ended up in our dimension at first, he could have ended up somewhere else.

So much here to chew over. This episode will most likely get a re-watch.

Comments

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

it basically gave me everything I wanted in one episode. Amazing.

Right, huh? I just sat there while it ticked, ticked, ticked off every one of my story kinks.

I am starting to doubt the Peter Pan connection with Bae, however. There's a subtext with him that makes me doubt it. He is always shown as so pathetically mundane. And I don't think that can all be accounted for by "I had to make my own way without my father for 29 years." The first time we see him, for example, in the first episode of season 2, there's a camera fake out where we have a close-up of the fairytale-ish horse-drawn wagons of Central Park in NY that makes us think we're in the fairytale land, then we find out we're not. Then we see Neal, looking like an uninspired work-a-day drone, heading to the subway, entering a crappy apartment, losing the music that is shielding him from the city when his iPod falls out a window.

I remember just squirming through that, thinking, "God, if *anyone* needs magic in their life, it's That Guy."

The irony of him therefore being Baelfire, who left the Fairytale land to get away from magic is delicious, because he has a damned good reason to avoid his father, avoid Storybrooke, be ticked off the girl he was in love with comes from that land, be ticked off the son he just found out he has is neck-deep in the fallout of that land, and that he can't make a better life for himself through the opportunity they represent *without* getting his feet dirty in that land as well.

And yet, he's going to need to, not just for emotional healing, but because I don't think he really likes his life as much as he claims to in order to put up a good solid wall with Rumple. He has to embrace magic in some form to fix things.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

I am starting to doubt the Peter Pan connection with Bae, however. There's a subtext with him that makes me doubt it. He is always shown as so pathetically mundane. And I don't think that can all be accounted for by "I had to make my own way without my father for 29 years."

Agreed. While it is tempting to make him another storybrook/fairytale land character - it doesn't quite work with the set-up or the thread of the story.

Also too coincidental. Afterall we already have the connection with Hook that his mother ran off and left him for Hook, and his father killed his mother for being with Hook. Do we really need more? I like the irony, but it doesn't quite work.

And while Neil Cassaday is sort of a Beat Generation take on Peter Pan, it still takes away from the feeling that this is a person who fled magic. I don't see him embracing Tinkerbell and Pixy dust, particularly after the last time he did - he was sucked down a porthole into another world.

No, I think you are right - the story-arc with Bae is somewhat similar to Emma in Season 1 - someone who desperately needs magic in their life, but is either skeptical or afraid to embrace it due to trust issues.

Also they've done a good job of showing how pathetic and lonely Bae's life is - and how pleasantly surprised he was to see Emma, that is until he found out she was tracking him for Rumplestilskin. I got the feeling from the end of the episode that he wasn't willing to shut Emma and Henry out of his life again just to escape his father - if that had been the case - he'd have taken off and not come back to his apartment to protect Emma from his father. Nor would he have given his father those 3 minutes.

Very happy about this turn of events. And somewhat surprised they actually did it. Too often they just tease you mercilessly about the possibility. This is actually one thing that I've noticed about current TV show - the serials no longer mercilessly tease the viewers.
In fact all the show's creators say the same thing: "Don't worry, we're not going to be like Lost and keep you hanging." And they really aren't - because if they are, the audience scampers off to another channel.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

I got the feeling from the end of the episode that he wasn't willing to shut Emma and Henry out of his life again just to escape his father - if that had been the case - he'd have taken off and not come back to his apartment to protect Emma from his father. Nor would he have given his father those 3 minutes.

Me, too. There is SO MUCH story ahead for Bae/Neal, finding out about all the (somewhat horrible) things Rumple did in order to find his son, finding out about what happened to his mother, getting to know Henry, learning about Emma's life after they parted. Seeing Storybrooke and reintegrating with his Fairytale Land roots.

Emotional healing and/or more emotional disintegration as the case may be as he finds all this stuff out, and last but not least, figuring out how magic really does fit into his life, if it does.

I got myself a new TV nuclear family last night. Big-on Emma/Henry/Bae-Neal 'shipper.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

I got myself a new TV nuclear family last night. Big-on Emma/Henry/Bae-Neal 'shipper.

I've become one as well. Actually I like the extended family...we got the evil grand-parents/great-grandparents/step-parents on one side, and the nice grandparents/great-grandparents on the other.

Lots of fun.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

The extended family is AWESOME. Any daytime soap would wish to be this thick with angsty gooeyness.

I read some people not wanting the Rumple-is-your-granddaddy situation that came with Bae/Neal being Henry's father, but the dramatic potential is every writer's dream.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Agreed. It's writer gold. So many things to do with it.

Read the same posts, including some in response to my own posts, and I admittedly don't understand the people who didn't like it or want it. Had to restrain myself from arguing with them, because I just do not understand their point of view. It's a disconnect.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

They've set Bae up pretty well as a character with lots of obstacles and issues to work with upon entering the story.

Getting to know his son (which he would want, and which will motivate him to make the effort).

Dealing with Emma (who does have a legitimate reason to be PISSED and hurt and distrustful of him).

Dealing with his father (who HE has legitimate reasons to be pissed, hurt and distrustful of).

And honestly, someone needs to punch Pinnochio.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

And honestly, someone needs to punch Pinnochio.

LOL. Personally, I'm hoping it's Emma.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

LOL! Me too.

If anyone should get the chance to punch him, it's Emma.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

And honestly, someone needs to punch Pinnochio.

If only they can find him. I really would like to see an Emma/Pinnochio confrontation.

He's literally responsible for Emma growing up without anyone, Henry being separated from his parents, and the split of Bae and Emma.

They've done a great job of setting up the character of Baelfire this season.
One of the most interesting characters I've seen - he's a con-man, a thief,
Rumplestilskin's lost son, and has connections with various characters in the story.

I think I've found a new male character to ship.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

One thing that struck me is that now Rumpy has a son that looks older than his GIRLFRIEND!

But the Seer that he was told to guard, told him that if he fought, his child would be fatherless.

Ah. There's the rub. That's what Rumpy heard, but that is not what she said. What she said was that what happened tomorrow would leave his child fatherless. He assumed that because the battle was 'tomorrow', that meant the battle. But what 'happened' was Rumpy going all Misery on himself and branding himself coward... which then began his obsession with power... which made him the Dark One... which left his son fatherless.

Prophecies: They are tricky things.

And I still have suspicions (from Bae's comment of "you don't know how long I've been running...") that Bae is also a Lost Boy from Neverland (and that's now Hook knew that Bae didn't want to be found.

All-in-all, I'm happy with the revelations because I'd rather seem them navigate the mindfield of interpersonal relationships. (Bae might not want to have to deal with Rumpy, but he basically has to if he wishes to know his own son).

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

A grown-up Peter Pan (condemned to) living a mundane life in the ordinary world would be a reprise of the 1991 movie, "Hook" (with Robin Williams/Dustin Hoffman/Maggie Smith). Does Disney or ABC have rights to that film? I suppose they wouldn't need it to rip off the idea, but if they *did* have rights, going on OUAT's history, they wouldn't hesitate to use it.

And it would work here. If you've seen that film, Peter has lost his memory of his time in Neverland and is totally absorbed in his adult, real-world life. So much so he has lost touch with his wife and children, especially his son.

By having his children kidnapped to Neverland by Hook, who wants to avenge himself on his old rival, Peter is forced to remember that life, hang out with the lost boys, and become Peter Pan again. He rediscovers the magic of his childhood formative years. He goes back to the mundane world after that to be with his family, and now has a son who hero-worships his Pan father.

That could work on multiple levels with Neal, who is desperately in need of a magical slap upside the head to revive his life, and needs to bond with a son he just discovered. And give Hook a "hook" into getting his revenge against Rumplestiltskin by reviving another old rivalry, his rivalry with Peter Pan. And possibly put Henry in danger, requiring parental intervention from both parents, and grandparents, but especially from Neal, who, if PP, would know how to defeat Hook.

That has some awesome potential.

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

He wouldn't necessarily have to be Peter Pan (though it would explain how earnest Bae became the thief Neal). OUAT often supplants a primary character with a secondary one. So like Jack the Giant Killer became disposable, Peter Pan may not be a central character, but a secondary one with Bae being a Lost Boy (which he sort of literally was) who eventually made it to a more mundane world.

He could be Peter Pan though. I still remember the large group photo/promo at the beginning of the season showing Henry dressed sort of Peter Pan-like and the writers saying that the wardrobe choice would make sense later.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

True. Peter Pan like Jacque could be disposable or even female. Or not even met yet for that matter.

There are a lot of hints that Bae spent time in Neverland - in the episode Tallhasse...where he says things off hand about being a Lost Boy and this isn't quite like Neverland, which Emma and the audience assume are just pop culture references.

Also Hook refers to lost boys a lot, and of course the ultimate lost boy is Baelfire - who got lost through a portal.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Does Disney or ABC have rights to that film? I suppose they wouldn't need it to rip off the idea, but if they *did* have rights, going on OUAT's history, they wouldn't hesitate to use it.

1. According to Wikipedia...Spielberg developed Hook originally with Disney, so Disney originally had the rights. Actually Disney has subsidiary rights to Peter Pan. I remember the writers discussing it in an interview and saying, not this season - we have a few hurdles on copyright, but it's getting there.And then in a second interview? We're definitely going to Neverland next season - we have the rights.

2. They can rip off the idea behind Hook. There's no copyright on a grown-up Peter Pan character. Also it's not like Bae is a lawyer with a family and well-to-do. Nor was Robin Williams the son of Rumplestilskin. Copyright is all about the details.

That could work on multiple levels with Neal, who is desperately in need of a magical slap upside the head to revive his life, and needs to bond with a son he just discovered. And give Hook a "hook" into getting his revenge against Rumplestiltskin by reviving another old rivalry, his rivalry with Peter Pan. And possibly put Henry in danger, requiring parental intervention from both parents, and grandparents, but especially from Neal, who, if PP, would know how to defeat Hook.

That has some awesome potential.

Oh yes. It's what I want at any rate. Big time story kinks right there.
Although...there's another wrinkle. Emma and Hook had chemistry. And Hook took Milla from Bae, while Rumple killed Mila because she was with Hook.

Actually this reminds me a lot of the Wendy(Tinkerbell)/Peter/Hook trope. Peter hunting his lost mother. Tinkerbell and Wendy are the lost mother,
Hook the abusive father who replaces dear old Dad.

And think about the pattern of this series to date?

Stepmother Regina = Evil Queen - to Snow White, and Stepmother/Grandmother to
Emma. (The controlling mother)

In Peter Pan legend...we have an abandoned boy, Peter, who goes to Neverland and fights with Hook, who in some respects represents the nasty father that the boy must defeat - often to save his mother or girlfriend. In the Peter Pan story - he fights Hook to save Wendy. In the film Hook, he fights Hook to save his daughter and his son from becoming Hook.

Here - we have Rumplestilskin as the dark father...but Captain Hook is Bae's legitimate stepfather. Just as Regina is Snow's legitimate stepmother.

The step-great-grandparents are fighting to take Henry away.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

I think the step-great-grandparents are a bit out of the loop, but their plan to use Rumple as a tool against the Charming Snow clan would still work in this scenario. It would just come out of left field in the issues that the new extended bio-family is working out from within.

I can see the Emma/Hook chemistry, but I'm dead against that pairing. It's one thing for Emma to fall for the thief-with-a-heart-of-gold Bae/Neal brand bad-boy, another thing entirely for her to fall for the slimy-blow-with-the-wind Hook brand bad boy. The way she is written, she'd have to lose a lot of her "nobility" to go there, and I just don't see her doing it, not in an all-out way, and not in a Belle/Rumple "you can change!" way (which would suck all the sexy out of Hook if it happened).

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

I can see the Emma/Hook chemistry, but I'm dead against that pairing. It's one thing for Emma to fall for the thief-with-a-heart-of-gold Bae/Neal brand bad-boy, another thing entirely for her to fall for the slimy-blow-with-the-wind Hook brand bad boy. The way she is written, she'd have to lose a lot of her "nobility" to go there, and I just don't see her doing it, not in an all-out way, and not in a Belle/Rumple "you can change!" way (which would suck all the sexy out of Hook if it happened).

I agree. Milla made sense, Emma doesn't. Also it's too...oh my Mom did it, and now Emma's doing the same thing? No.

Emma giving up Henry in a manner that is oddly similar to Snow makes sense.
Emma "hooking" up with Captain Hook...doesn't. Although they appear to playing Hook as a sort of Jack Sparrow type of character, with Emma as a shout-out to the Swan character in Pirates of the Caribbean...

But I do agree with you. We're talking about a character with serious trust issues, the last thing she'd do is hook up with a Pirate.

Besides, I'm a Neal(Bae)/Emma shipper. I like Bae better than Hook, find him to be more layered and far more interesting. Hook hasn't been developed enough. I wish they'd made Michael Raymond James a regular...but it did take the guy playing Hook (Colin O'Donogue) at least ten episodes before that happened.

They better not kill Bae, I'll be highly annoyed. He's my new favorite male character.

Hook, Regina and Rumple have a long way to go before they come close to being redeemed. Plus, I still haven't quite forgiven Hook for taking Aurora's heart and shooting Belle. He's not a nice guy. And I think Bae is hotter, personally.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

Ironically, I'd call Bae/Neal the "rumpled-cute" type guy.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

Ironically, I'd call Bae/Neal the "rumpled-cute" type guy.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

LOL! Sort of like Robert Carlyle's RumpleStilskin - who is the sort of character you want to punch-hug.

Both great character actors.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

Except Grownup!Bae is a lot more rumpled than Rumple, who at least attempts to look dapper.

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

One thing that struck me is that now Rumpy has a son that looks older than his GIRLFRIEND!

So does Emma for that matter. It's amusing that Emma and Baelfire look older than Charming, Snow, Regina, Hook, and Belle. And in a way they are - they didn't stagnate for 28 years. The others sort of were frozen in time. Remember what Henry said about the clock never moving forward and nothing changing here, everything was sort of mundane and monotonous until Emma showed up and suddenly things were happening?