The TV Cult Meme Revisited and Quibbled Over by a TV slut

[shadowkat]

Regarding that meme on TV Guide's top 30 Cult TV Shows? Have a few quibbles regarding their definition of cult, which reminds me of a lengthy lunch debate I had with a guy I dated a few years back at Evil Company. He said that only fantasy and sci-fi shows were *cult*. I said, no, a sci-fi show might not be cult. X-Files for example had jumped out of cult status. Cult - I informed him - was a tv series, film or book that was not liked by the *mainstream* or not a *best-seller* - it had a specific niche or fringe audience. People adored it, but they didn't talk about it in public and it wasn't something you saw in the Neilson ratings. It's the sort of thing - that someone will hesistantly admit to in an elevator and you'll stop and say cool! ME too!

In short - a show like The Sopranos was NOT cult. While Buffy the Vampire Slayer definitely was. Cult was not the same as *excellent* or *horrid* - what it meant was a show that may or may not be loved by critics, was often dismissed, and never taken seriously by the powers that be - the best seller lists, Nielsen's, EW's and mainstream media - and you have to hunt on your tv dial - because it appears at weird times, jumps channels, and well is hard to find. CULT is a show or book or film you discover through your friends. Not the media. It's not advertised. It's not well marketed. Until after we've discovered it - long after. Yet, at the same time, CULT is also something that has a certain quality or lasting resonance. Something that scholars will obsess over. CULT is an artwork people OBSESS over. Not easily dismissed by its fans.

Cult often has a weird title. Like The Rocky Horror Picture Show or Buffy the Vampire Slayer. It's just left of center. Off the beaten track. Cult never gets awards except from fringe groups. And often has obsessive fans who go to conventions to celebrate it or late night viewings or who collect everything associated with it. They debate it vehemently but don't tell co-workers.

Course many people disagree with my definition. The guy I dated did. We ended up calling a stalemate. (Or he just shut-up and let me win.)

Shows that I don't believe can be cult because they are celebrated by the mainstream and consider pop= Lost, Heroes, Six Feet Under, Sopranoes, Seinfield, MASH, Hill Street Blues, Ugly Betty, Grey's Anatomy, Star Wars (although it does have weird obsessive fans, but they aren't quite the same as cult fans) and Harry Potter. (Note the difference - Pop = popular items. CULT = those things that live under the wire.)

Here's my list of CULT TV shows that I know about, in no particular order:

1. Buffy the Vampire Slayer
2. Star Trek (the original one)
3. Voyager
4. Deep Space Nine
5. Angel
6. Dark Angel
7. American Gothic
8. Highlander
9. Xenia
10. Space Above and Beyond
11. Firefly
12. Wonderfalls
13. Dead Like Me
14. Doctor Who
15. BattleStar Galatica2
16. Jericho
17. HEx
18. Forever Knight
19. Supernatural
20. Star Gate
21. Farscape
22. Mystery Theater 2000
23. Veronica Mars
24. Strangers with Candy
25. Rosewell
26. BlackAdder
27. Monty Python
28. Arrested Development
29. Profit
30. H&R PuffnStuff
31. Twin Peaks...which jumped sort of to the mainstream
32. Smallville
33. Tru Calling

Cult's the shows that you worry about getting renewed. That you have to hunt down. And you keep trying to get people to like, or you keep to yourself. They aren't water cooler chatter.

They are things like Rocky Horror Picture Show, Tremors...buried at the bottom of the video store. Not in wide release. On late at night. OR out of print.

What do you think?

Agree? Disagree?

Comments

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Good break down. Yes, I'd agree with your definitions and you've managed to clarify for me why I don't think Star Trek really qualifies as cult any longer, nor for that matter Due South - which was popular in the Us for several seasons and in the Neilsons. Same deal with Northern Exposure which don't really fit that category.

Shows with a certain quirkiness about them that virtually guarantees they'll be limited to a small audience.

Main criteria - I think. Has to have that certain quirkiness. Shows like Wonderfalls, Firefly, Buffy, Angel, Arrested Development, Mystery Science Theater, Red Dwarf, Farscape, and Doctor Who all had it.

2. Shows before their time - tough one since some of these shows are actually mainstream or would be if it weren't for a)market saturation or b)people aren't in the mood. Judd Apatow is a good example.

3.Shows killed by network bungling. Wonderfalls. Firefly. Shows that desperately needed some nurturing, but received the axe. I'm looking forward to/dreading Bryan Fuller's Pushing Daisies, because I can see another quick and bloody death ahead.

Bryan Fuller is the same guy, I think, that did Dead Like Me and Wonderfalls. Not positive. So yep, me too on Pushing Daisies.
It feels quirky and quirky tends to turn off mainstream audiences. (I'm the opposite - the quirkier it is, the more likely I'll watch it. More mainstream? More likely I won't...LOL!)

Most cult shows fall under this category, I think. The hard to find, short-lived, picked up by cable, foreign imports.

Forever Knight was a great example - a Canadian import and riff off of a Rick Springsteen made for tv movie/pilot.

Completely agree about Star Trek - much like Star Wars and X-Files = it has become thoroughly mainstream. BattleStar Galatica is still cult, although it sits on the cusp. As is the Gates. But of the sci-fi series - I'd say the best example of a cult series is Farscape. It's too quirky for mainstream, was cancelled before its time, jumped time slots, brought back by fans, and hard to get a hold of - the DVD's are outrageously expensive.
And it has a small but loyal following.

In some ways it's more cult than even Doctor Who.

[cjlasky.livejournal.com]

Oh absolutely--Farscape is the definition of a cult show. It's cult when you ask rabid fans of the SAME GENRE, and they shrug and say, "Huh. You know, for some reason I could never get into that one." (For me, it was Arrested Development. Saw what the creator was trying to do, even respected it, but I hated most of the characters and the obsessive self-referentiality drove me nuts.)

[shadowkat67.livejournal.com]

Exactly.

It's cult when people who love the genre don't get it. What? You like that?
Huh?

The 4400 is cult.
Heroes is mainstream.

Farscape is cult.
Star Gate is more mainstream.

People get confused because they think *cult* means the show is *better* than a mainstream show. Not necessarily true. Just because something is *cult* doesn't mean it is good nor does it mean its bad. What it means is that it is something most people don't know about. Under the wire.

Arrested Development is another great example. (I respected it - saw what they were trying to do - but like you the self-referential humor got on my nerves.)

AD = cult
The Office = mainstream

Buffy =cult
Charmed = mainstream (most people know about it.)

The Family Guy = cult
The Simpsons = mainstream

The X-Files = mainstream
Space Above and Beyond = cult

Red Dwarf, BlackAdder = both cult.

On the fence about Supernatural - most people seem to know it.
But it does have the trappings of cult.