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shadowkatWell I downloaded Firefox and it still didn't block the pop-up ads. I also don't like how Firefox is setup. Too use to Windows Internet Explorer...evil, but comforting.
Curious about something - it's a general question, well sort of - to all who read this:
How much importance do you place on awards? By that I mean - not how much you place on getting them yourself, but how much you place on choosing to see a film, watching a tv show, or reading a story or book or something on the internet based on awards it has received?
For example:
Do you choose to watch a tv show because it won an Emmy? Or do you care?
How about a movie - would you go see a movie just because it won a bunch of awards? Would you decide to go see AVATAR if it won best picture?
What about books? Would you be more likely to read or buy a book if it won the Booker, Pulitzer, National, Hugo or Nebula book awards?
Do you choose fanfiction or metas based on the rewards they get? Or just recs?
How about music? If an album wins a Grammy - would you be more likely to listen to it?
Or does it matter? Really?
I'm curious. I know if a film, book, tv show, or piece of music wins an award it is more likely to get distributors and have a bigger marketing campaign, also the creator is more likely to get a second deal or get it extended in print or if a tv show, another season.Mad Men for example got reknewed based purely on it's critical acclaim and awards at the Emmy's and Golden Globes. It was not based on ratings, which are below most tv shows. Few people actually watch Mad Man. It has a nitch audience.
So, my question is - what is the importance to you, personally, regarding awards?
I have mixed feelings myself. I want them of course, only human. But time and experience have taught me that taste is subjective and often fickel. And most things put in competition against each other, are well, a bit like holding a competition with fruit - which is best: the apple, the grape, the orange, the banana, or the nectarine? Personally? I'd say the apple, but it depends on my mood. Can you really compare films like Avatar, Up in the Air,
Precious, Broken Embraces, Nine, Up, Inglorius Bastards, and Coraline? They are vastly different films. Or what about Lawrence of Arabia vs. To Kill a Mockingbird? In music - Taylor Swift vs. Lady Gaga??? I mean, come on, that's like comparing Kris Allen's folk/country to Adam Lambert Glam/Soul/Rock - waite they did that. Or how about Catherine Valente's Girl Who Circumvented Fairyland ( a web book) vs. Joss Whedon's video musical Doctor Horrible's Sing a Long Blog? (I can't imagine a contest that actually pitted those two vastly different creations against each other, but it happened.)
In sports - it makes more sense. We pit athelets of similar skills against each other. Skiers against Skiers, figure skaters against figure skaters. Even break it down into specific categories...so that downhill skiers aren't competing agains mogules. Or figure skaters aren't competing against speed skaters. But the arts for some reason...tends to be harder.
I don't know. I know that I will often pick a book or piece of writing that has won an award over one that hasn't. I read Bone People because it won the Booker Prize. And I've seen films that I knew were nominated for an Oscar, because they were nominated. (Since grown out of that practice, Titantic and Ghandi sort of killed it - both won, and both bored me.)
So, I guess in a way I do pay attention - out of curiousity. And like all creative people, all people, I like the recognition. Having won few awards in my lifetime - it does make me happy when I do. But I still wonder...how much importance do we place on it?
On an entirely different topic...rewatched last year's Lost season finale last night. Whoa.
That is one amazing episode. I may have to write a meta on it yet. I particularly love this exchange:
After much pain and suffering, and bad deeds, anti-hero and tragic figure, Bejamin Linus,
comes face to face with his maker or god, if you will, Jacob...who he's followed, been devoted to, and yet never seen or gotten an audience with until now...and Jacob is still more interested in someone else, or so he appears to be.
Ben to Jacob: What about me? What about me, Jacob!
Jacob: What about you?
It's so perfect. Man rails at the heavens in a narcissitic yell...and the heavens look down and wonder, seeing man as but one thread in an every expanding tapestry filled with many inter-connecting threads, all equally important, and all railing, and smiles...yes, I see you, but if you'd stop whining for a moment, you might see everyone and everything else, which lies around you.
Brilliant episode. Possibly helped by the fact that it focused primarily on Ben/Lock and Sawyer/Juliet - my two favorite pairings, and my four favorite characters on the series.
I adore those four.
This sync's nicely into a rather marvelous series of fanfiction I've been reading. Rarihah's (sp?) or the Barbverse series: Raising in the Sun, Necessary Evils, and Parilament of Monsters surprised me. I had avoided it, because I thought it was babyfic (which I can't abide - seems OOC to me in BTVS). But these three tales aren't. They aren't really Spuffy either, although Spuffy is definitely a component and if Spuffy squicks you like Bangle currently squicks me for some reason (didn't use to, does now - my rewatch last year, including I Will Always Remember You...and the Twilight series via Stephanie Meyer may have something to do with that), you probably want to avoid big time, but...if it doesn't and you are a Willow fan or a Willow/Tara or Willow/Kennedy fan - you want to read this. She explores Willow from just about every angle imaginable, and in a way I don't see very often. As well as the Willow/Tara relationship. Her other characters, with the possible exception of Angel, are handled quite well. She nails Xander and Xander is very likable and caring in this fic.
Not evil or romanticized. (a lot of Spike fic writers have grudges against Xander, she doesn't. I don't like grudge fic , it annoys me.) She also handles Giles well and allows Giles to be a scholar, with an academic interest in vampires. Each character is interesting.
The weakness so far is Angel - who I'm guessing the writer doesn't like and is struggling with. Angel is a hard character to write - because he is so dark and broody and angsty. People either write him like a straight-up hero with black cape billowing a la Edward in Twilight meets Nick Knight in Forever Knight (if those two had a kid and sigh, eww) or they write him as a whiny, egotistical, domineering, ass. Either makes me cringe. Here he falls more into the whiny side of the fence. Luckily he doesn't show up that much, so you can ignore it. That said, this fic is brilliant in how it discusses what vampires are, morality,
and the meaning of souls - I may not necessarily agree, but I am fascinated by the layers.
Highly recommend that you check this out, if you have not already.
As a caveat should state that while I have read quite a bit of fanfiction outside of Buffy and outside of Spuffy, stories that feature Spike and specifically Spuffy tend to be my preference. Mostly because the stupid series did not resolve the relationship in my opinion, or that character's arc to my satisfaction, so I'm still sort of hunting a resolution. See they resolved all her other ones, although they don't appear to think they did or that they audience thinks they did because they keep revisiting these relationships to the point in which I want to grab them and scream I get it! I get it! Now can you tell me what you meant at the end of Chosen, because I want to know if I interpreted that scene correctly and if the relationship is truly over because both characters have moved on, or Buffy didn't really love him in that way and just cared deeply for him as a friend and he's moved on to Illyria, or just over because Buffy thinks he's dead, but if he wasn't.... Thank you.
Curious about something - it's a general question, well sort of - to all who read this:
How much importance do you place on awards? By that I mean - not how much you place on getting them yourself, but how much you place on choosing to see a film, watching a tv show, or reading a story or book or something on the internet based on awards it has received?
For example:
Do you choose to watch a tv show because it won an Emmy? Or do you care?
How about a movie - would you go see a movie just because it won a bunch of awards? Would you decide to go see AVATAR if it won best picture?
What about books? Would you be more likely to read or buy a book if it won the Booker, Pulitzer, National, Hugo or Nebula book awards?
Do you choose fanfiction or metas based on the rewards they get? Or just recs?
How about music? If an album wins a Grammy - would you be more likely to listen to it?
Or does it matter? Really?
I'm curious. I know if a film, book, tv show, or piece of music wins an award it is more likely to get distributors and have a bigger marketing campaign, also the creator is more likely to get a second deal or get it extended in print or if a tv show, another season.Mad Men for example got reknewed based purely on it's critical acclaim and awards at the Emmy's and Golden Globes. It was not based on ratings, which are below most tv shows. Few people actually watch Mad Man. It has a nitch audience.
So, my question is - what is the importance to you, personally, regarding awards?
I have mixed feelings myself. I want them of course, only human. But time and experience have taught me that taste is subjective and often fickel. And most things put in competition against each other, are well, a bit like holding a competition with fruit - which is best: the apple, the grape, the orange, the banana, or the nectarine? Personally? I'd say the apple, but it depends on my mood. Can you really compare films like Avatar, Up in the Air,
Precious, Broken Embraces, Nine, Up, Inglorius Bastards, and Coraline? They are vastly different films. Or what about Lawrence of Arabia vs. To Kill a Mockingbird? In music - Taylor Swift vs. Lady Gaga??? I mean, come on, that's like comparing Kris Allen's folk/country to Adam Lambert Glam/Soul/Rock - waite they did that. Or how about Catherine Valente's Girl Who Circumvented Fairyland ( a web book) vs. Joss Whedon's video musical Doctor Horrible's Sing a Long Blog? (I can't imagine a contest that actually pitted those two vastly different creations against each other, but it happened.)
In sports - it makes more sense. We pit athelets of similar skills against each other. Skiers against Skiers, figure skaters against figure skaters. Even break it down into specific categories...so that downhill skiers aren't competing agains mogules. Or figure skaters aren't competing against speed skaters. But the arts for some reason...tends to be harder.
I don't know. I know that I will often pick a book or piece of writing that has won an award over one that hasn't. I read Bone People because it won the Booker Prize. And I've seen films that I knew were nominated for an Oscar, because they were nominated. (Since grown out of that practice, Titantic and Ghandi sort of killed it - both won, and both bored me.)
So, I guess in a way I do pay attention - out of curiousity. And like all creative people, all people, I like the recognition. Having won few awards in my lifetime - it does make me happy when I do. But I still wonder...how much importance do we place on it?
On an entirely different topic...rewatched last year's Lost season finale last night. Whoa.
That is one amazing episode. I may have to write a meta on it yet. I particularly love this exchange:
After much pain and suffering, and bad deeds, anti-hero and tragic figure, Bejamin Linus,
comes face to face with his maker or god, if you will, Jacob...who he's followed, been devoted to, and yet never seen or gotten an audience with until now...and Jacob is still more interested in someone else, or so he appears to be.
Ben to Jacob: What about me? What about me, Jacob!
Jacob: What about you?
It's so perfect. Man rails at the heavens in a narcissitic yell...and the heavens look down and wonder, seeing man as but one thread in an every expanding tapestry filled with many inter-connecting threads, all equally important, and all railing, and smiles...yes, I see you, but if you'd stop whining for a moment, you might see everyone and everything else, which lies around you.
Brilliant episode. Possibly helped by the fact that it focused primarily on Ben/Lock and Sawyer/Juliet - my two favorite pairings, and my four favorite characters on the series.
I adore those four.
This sync's nicely into a rather marvelous series of fanfiction I've been reading. Rarihah's (sp?) or the Barbverse series: Raising in the Sun, Necessary Evils, and Parilament of Monsters surprised me. I had avoided it, because I thought it was babyfic (which I can't abide - seems OOC to me in BTVS). But these three tales aren't. They aren't really Spuffy either, although Spuffy is definitely a component and if Spuffy squicks you like Bangle currently squicks me for some reason (didn't use to, does now - my rewatch last year, including I Will Always Remember You...and the Twilight series via Stephanie Meyer may have something to do with that), you probably want to avoid big time, but...if it doesn't and you are a Willow fan or a Willow/Tara or Willow/Kennedy fan - you want to read this. She explores Willow from just about every angle imaginable, and in a way I don't see very often. As well as the Willow/Tara relationship. Her other characters, with the possible exception of Angel, are handled quite well. She nails Xander and Xander is very likable and caring in this fic.
Not evil or romanticized. (a lot of Spike fic writers have grudges against Xander, she doesn't. I don't like grudge fic , it annoys me.) She also handles Giles well and allows Giles to be a scholar, with an academic interest in vampires. Each character is interesting.
The weakness so far is Angel - who I'm guessing the writer doesn't like and is struggling with. Angel is a hard character to write - because he is so dark and broody and angsty. People either write him like a straight-up hero with black cape billowing a la Edward in Twilight meets Nick Knight in Forever Knight (if those two had a kid and sigh, eww) or they write him as a whiny, egotistical, domineering, ass. Either makes me cringe. Here he falls more into the whiny side of the fence. Luckily he doesn't show up that much, so you can ignore it. That said, this fic is brilliant in how it discusses what vampires are, morality,
and the meaning of souls - I may not necessarily agree, but I am fascinated by the layers.
Highly recommend that you check this out, if you have not already.
As a caveat should state that while I have read quite a bit of fanfiction outside of Buffy and outside of Spuffy, stories that feature Spike and specifically Spuffy tend to be my preference. Mostly because the stupid series did not resolve the relationship in my opinion, or that character's arc to my satisfaction, so I'm still sort of hunting a resolution. See they resolved all her other ones, although they don't appear to think they did or that they audience thinks they did because they keep revisiting these relationships to the point in which I want to grab them and scream I get it! I get it! Now can you tell me what you meant at the end of Chosen, because I want to know if I interpreted that scene correctly and if the relationship is truly over because both characters have moved on, or Buffy didn't really love him in that way and just cared deeply for him as a friend and he's moved on to Illyria, or just over because Buffy thinks he's dead, but if he wasn't.... Thank you.
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no subject
Date: 2010-01-29 06:02 pm (UTC)I'm not sure if you are reading the comics or not? And how spoiled you are??
For me, I still want or need something more from the story, not necessarily a romantic ending per se...but a bit more. It's hard to explain. I want closure. Granted that does NOT happen in real life. In real life...what you state above is what happens. I know that's been my own experience. But in stories - we often want the opposite of our own experience. We want the closures that we don't get in real life. Not always, but sometimes.
Regarding mystery? I'm all for a little mystery in a character, and there is actually still quite a bit, but not on this point.
The problem a lot of writer's have and Whedon is increasingly falling into this category for me is they tell you far too much about one thing, not enough about another. I could live a very long time without knowing anything more about Andrew, Amy or Warren. ;-)
no subject
Date: 2010-01-29 08:03 pm (UTC)No, I don't read the comics (the transposition of characters so brilliantly incarnated by living talented actors to flat paper drawings... not my thing at all, or it would require somebody much more talented and with much more finesse and understanding than Jeanty)but J Whedon's ideas and writings interest me, so I read the reviews with interest (your's, Stromwreath's, Angearia's, Maggie's and other's too). My take on the story is only indirect and I lack many details, but I'm more or less up to date on the general outlines.
"" It certainly is, but could you try to explain on what point you want a closure (if it pleases you of course)?
If by closure you mean,as your own post seems to suggest knowing, amongst other things, if the ILY was really meant, I'm not sure Whedon will ever clarify that. The relationship he described between the two characters (at least it's my take on it) is one of these rare relationships that can't be defined by one or even several words but are so deep, so complex that they go to the every roots of the being and leave you incredibly richer as well as marked for the rest of your life. I'm not sure a real closure is possible for such relationships because their legacy is living in the being (I'm not sure I can better explain what I mean) but they certainly can change and evolve.
In regard what will happen in the comics, Maggie's posts and your's, have convinced me for a long time now that there were reasons to see Spike come back. And his role will probably be significant or all the careful build up to it ("teasings", foreshadowing, obstinate silence...) wouldn't be worth the effort. And of course I'm happy about that and curious (though a "little" anxious -rolls eyes at herself for being in love with a character!)to see what Whedon will do with him.
no subject
Date: 2010-01-30 05:01 am (UTC)Hee. No need. I don't mind Andrew so much, just a bit tired of the character. That said, Predators and Prey which focused on him may well have been one of the better issues of the series - and it was oddly enough written by Doug Petrie. Doug Petrie seems better equipped to write for comics than Espenson. Who knew?
I love comics - possibly because I used to tell myself stories while drawing people and always fantasized about being able to draw a story. When I discovered that others had done this? I was in heaven. Pictures with words? Cool. So tend to be fairly tolerant of the art and adept at interpreting it. Been reading the things off and on for over 20 years. I'd given up on them or thought I had in 2001, until Whedon got me hooked again. I'm half hoping he'll either screw up the comics or just satisfy me enough...that I can wash my hands of it again. Because I really don't have the space to keep the things.
As for the art? It could be much worse. I've seen much worse.
It could be arty - like Persepolis or RR. Crumb, or boxy like the old super-hero action comics. This is actually pretty decent...if you know the alternatives. And since I tend to visualize stories while I read them...the art doesn't really phase me, I still see SMG, NB, AH, and all in my head playing and acting the roles, same as fanfic.
Will answer your other question in a separate reply.
no subject
Date: 2010-01-30 06:20 pm (UTC)You're right Jeanty's work is decent, it's just that after having seen the characters so vividly interpreted by the actors, the guy would need to be a real genious (like something of the Leonard de Vinci of the comics artists :-)) to be able to convince me. I'm not keen on F Urru's work either for the same reason.
no subject
Date: 2010-01-30 05:42 am (UTC)I guess, I can try. Not sure it will work...because in order to understand, you may have to love the character of "Buffy" as much as the character of Spike (which I do), and have watched all of Angel the Series, plus have stuck with the comics for three to four years. And engaged in pointless and unending arguments with B/A and B/X shippers. (there are quite a few on my flist) LOL! ;-)
After the show finished, I wrote a lengthy fanfic - about 50 pages, entitled No Regrets - it is posted on my lj somewhere, if you want to try it. A what-if tale, about a 40 year old Buffy climbing a mountain to visit a 40 year old Spike who shanshued and has become a bit of a recluse. She's living with Faith, not as lovers, so much as close friends/sisters, since Buffy doesn't strike me as anything other than straight to the bone. Not the best thing in the world, but my attempt at addressing some unresolved issues I had with the series. It didn't resolve them.
If by closure you mean,as your own post seems to suggest knowing, amongst other things, if the ILY was really meant, I'm not sure Whedon will ever clarify that.
I actually do agree with you on this and have argued the same myself in the past. Grown weary of arguing it actually. And I can see/understand the other interpretations. Whedon did write Chosen in a manner that was not clear and could be loosely interpreted. Angel's presence did not help. Nor did the atrocious cookie dough speech. All of which depending on your pov is either brilliant writing or really bad writing. ;-)
So no, it is not whether she meant ILY, because I am pretty certain that she did. Just as I am certain that she wanted him to leave with her and not stay and get burned to a crisp. Nor is it really a competition - which boy does she love the most. Because experience has taught me that you can love more than one person, just in different ways. I think what Andrew stated in Girl in Question made a lot of sense - she loves them both, for different reasons and in a different ways - which are about as comparable as asking me whether I love BSG or Buffy more. I love them differently. Nor is it whether he knew that she loved him - I'm pretty certain he knew and his response was not meant as a cancellation of that love or a denial of it, so much as an acknowledgment of it, and a reiteration of his own deep love and respect for her. He was basically letting her go in a way that he hoped would allow her to move on in a positive manner. Which is why he doesn't go after her, and is why he tells Andrew not to tell her that he is alive - because that would cancel out what he did - which was to free her from her obligation to him or to anyone like him. They basically liberated each other.
At least that is what I saw. I am not certain it is what was intended.
And Whedon may never make that clear. You are correct on that point.
Nor am I certain if Buffy wanted Spike to leave...this is a woman who has had every guy she's been romantically attached to, leave at some point or another, in much the same way her father did. Spike, interestingly enough, did not leave - until he died.
I think what I want to know is how she reacted to Spike being alive, which seems fairly minor I know, but I want to know. And how she feels about the fact that he chose not to come to her. I want to know if she was "in love" with him or just "loved" him. What she'd do if he were to appear in her life again. I'm not sure. I'm not sure she knows. This is a character that resonates for me, that I identified with on a certain level. I want to know what he meant to her, who he was to her...and yes, I think Whedon plans on addressing that on some level - because he said so in so many words.
Buffy and Spike's story still feels open-ended to me...like a loose thread in a tapestry that I want to fix. I don't necessarily see them riding off into the sunset together...I just want some of my nagging questions resolved...if that makes sense? It may not. Like I said hard to explain, because I'm not entirely sure why myself.
no subject
Date: 2010-01-30 06:50 pm (UTC)But your analysis of the last S/B scene is exactly how I read it (word for word) with an emphasis on the idea of freedom for both. I've encountered other interpretations of the scene, but if the ones that give the word love a friendly meaning seem perfectly adept in the context of the story, many others don't make sense at all because the picture they give of Buffy is repulsive and I have a hard time believing JW would propose as an icon a girl who has an IQ and a spiritual, emotional life equivalent to this of a slug. (Note that I in no way say she had to fall in love romantically with Spike, well you love who you love).
Thank you again for trying to explain things that are not easy to understand.